MR LAX: Mr Bosch, do you confirm that you are still under your former oath?
IZAK DANIEL BOSCH: (s.u.o.)
MR LAX: Thank you, you may be seated.
FURTHER EXAMINATION BY MR LAMEY: Thank you, Chairperson.
Mr Bosch, did you have the opportunity this morning to examine the packaging which has been handed in to the Chairperson, the Unisef packaging?
MR BOSCH: Yes, that is correct.
MR LAMEY: Is this the packaging in which the cassette player was when you purchased it?
MR BOSCH: Yes, it looks exactly like that.
MR LAMEY: Now at the stage - and can I just make sure from you, did you already give the cassettes to the Technical Division, or what is your recollection about this? This is before you arrived there when the parcel was being wrapped.
MR BOSCH: They already had the cassettes at that stage.
MR LAMEY: That would be the Neil Diamond and the BZN?
MR BOSCH: Yes, that is correct.
MR LAMEY: Now when you arrived there, when the package was being wrapped, what kind of packaging did you see, what is your recollection?
MR BOSCH: My recollection is the same as Kobus Kok, we wrapped that thing that is before the Chairperson.
MR LAMEY: Can you recall at which stage you arrived there, in what process was the packaging?
MR BOSCH: If I recall correctly there was perhaps one layer of paper around the parcel already and we put another layer of paper around the parcel, a second or a third layer, but it was already wrapped.
MR LAMEY: And Mr Kok testified about an unevenness.
MR BOSCH: Yes, that is correct.
MR LAMEY: What is your recollection?
MR BOSCH: I recall it as such as well.
MR LAMEY: So what you then recall is a container of a square shape with an uneven surface, wrapped in brown paper?
MR BOSCH: Tightly in brown paper.
MR LAMEY: Tightly in brown paper?
MR BOSCH: Yes, it was tightly wrapped.
MR LAMEY: And when you later saw the container once again at Vlakplaas, how did it look?
MR BOSCH: As I've already stated, the parcel was in a plastic bag, I did not pick up the parcel or feel it, I simply looked down into the bag.
MR LAMEY: And what did you see inside the bag, was it once again wrapped in brown paper?
MR BOSCH: Yes, it was wrapped in brown paper and something was written on it in koki pen.
CHAIRPERSON: Sorry, before you move on from there, you say that it was a square container with an uneven surface. Was the whole of the surface uneven or do you just mean there were lumps on top?
MR BOSCH: Just on top where the cassettes were situated.
CHAIRPERSON: It was the cassettes that made it uneven?
MR BOSCH: That is correct.
CHAIRPERSON: The rest was of it was just the square cardboard box.
MR BOSCH: Yes, that is correct.
MR LAMEY: I don't know whether there's anything further, Chairperson, that you would like to know from this witness.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR LAMEY
CHAIRPERSON: Any questions?
FURTHER CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR BOOYENS: Just one aspect.
Mr Bosch, this parcel spent quite some time in your locked office after it came from Technical, is that correct?
MR BOSCH: Yes, that is correct.
MR BOOYENS: Now I want you to try and remember, your office was usually kept locked.
MR BOSCH: Yes, that is correct. After my former evidence I have thought quite extensively about this matter, how could the parcel have been repackaged or exchanged perhaps, but if I recall correctly, there was someone else because I was already on my way to DCC, Charlie Chait would have taken over from me and he also had a key to my office.
MR BOOYENS: So how many keys were there?
MR BOSCH: There were three.
MR BOOYENS: You, de Kock and Charlie Chait?
MR BOSCH: That is correct.
MR BOOYENS: You have no independent recollection that the parcel had to wrapped more tightly at any stage?
MR BOSCH: No, as I've said, I didn't want to tamper or touch the package in any way, it was kept in the plastic bag.
MR BOOYENS: Very well. Thank you, Chairperson.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR BOOYENS
CHAIRPERSON: Before you leave, Mr Bosch, I would like to ask you about some other incidents.
MR BOSCH: Yes, Sir.
CHAIRPERSON: You were connected were you not, with other incidents where explosive devices were sent to people?
MR BOSCH: That is correct, Chairperson.
CHAIRPERSON: How many others?
MR BOSCH: Two others.
CHAIRPERSON: Which were they?
MR BOSCH: A parcel which went to Swaziland and a parcel which went to Zambia.
CHAIRPERSON: And were they before or after - to Zambia? Is that the radio bomb?
MR BOSCH: That is correct, Chairperson.
CHAIRPERSON: Were they before or after this incident?
MR BOSCH: It was before this.
CHAIRPERSON: And the parcel that was sent to Swaziland was opened by a postal worker and then exploded?
MR BOSCH: That is correct.
CHAIRPERSON: Did you know that before you sent this bomb to Lusaka again, the present one?
MR BOSCH: Yes, I knew that.
CHAIRPERSON: So you - did the other people at Vlakplaas know it?
MR BOSCH: That is correct, Chairperson.
CHAIRPERSON: So they were aware of the danger to innocent postal workers and people such as that, by sending bombs in the post?
MR BOSCH: That is correct.
CHAIRPERSON: But they nevertheless went ahead with it.
MR BOSCH: That is correct.
CHAIRPERSON: As did you.
MR BOSCH: Correct.
CHAIRPERSON: Any further questions?
MR LAX: Just one aspect, Chair.
We heard about another bomb that went to the PAC in Tanzania, if I remember correctly, were you involved in that one as well?
MR BOSCH: No, I don't think it was Tanzania, it was Zambia, the one that they found and defused. Then it may have been Tanzania.
CHAIRPERSON: Yes.
MR LAX: Okay. I'm just wondering whether there was some confusion. My recollection is Tanzania, Dar-es-salaam in fact.
MR BOSCH: That is possible.
CHAIRPERSON: Well in the amnesty application it says it was given to Jerry Raven to send to PAC members in Lusaka.
MR BOSCH: No, Chairperson, that is incorrect. I received the radio from Jerry Raven.
CHAIRPERSON: Oh sorry, bomb given to you by Jerry Raven, and you sent it to the PAC in Lusaka.
MR BOSCH: Yes. I may have been mistaken, but I know that it was sent to the PAC.
MR LAX: Thank you, Chair.
MACHINE SWITCHED OFF
MS LOCKHAT: No questions, thank you, Chairperson.
NO QUESTIONS BY MS LOCKHAT
CHAIRPERSON: Right. Well we'll take the short adjournment at this stage. You are excused from further attendance.
WITNESS EXCUSED
MR LAMEY: Chairperson, may I just enquire, Mr Nortje is also present, who I think saw the package afterwards. I don't know whether you want me to call him.
CHAIRPERSON: Well he's given evidence on it, hasn't he?
MR LAMEY: Yes.
CHAIRPERSON: Everybody so far has denied any knowledge of the change of the package, of writing anything on it, of putting any stickers on it.
MR LAMEY: Yes, Chairperson, I know, but I think Mr Nortje hasn't had an opportunity to be able to look at the photographs.
CHAIRPERSON: Oh well you can let him look at the photographs and he give evidence after the adjournment.
MR LAMEY: As it pleases, Chairperson.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS
ON RESUMPTION
CHAIRPERSON: I am now handing over possession of the packet, the white wrapping and the Neil Diamond tape and accept no further - and the second photographic album.
MR BOOYENS: Mr Chairman, as my learned friend appearing for Gen van Rensburg, has indicated - that's of course always subject to the Committee's attitude, Mr Bellingan is available and my learned friend as you heard, indicated that he wouldn't be with him long, he just wants to put Gen van Rensburg's version to him. I do not know whether the Committee would make it possible for us to interpose Mr Bellingan at this stage.
MR VICTOR: That is indeed my request, Chairperson.
MR LAMEY: Chairperson, may I just, as far as Mr Nortje is concerned, I have taken instructions and I submit that Mr Nortje really cannot take the matter any further.
CHAIRPERSON: ...(indistinct - no microphone)
MR HATTINGH: Nortje? I have no questions for him and I don't think he can take this issue any further, Mr Chairman.
CHAIRPERSON: As far as I can gather, nobody here wants, at the present moment, wants to ask him any further questions, so unless you have some devastating information you wish to disclose.
MR LAMEY: No, Chairperson.
CHAIRPERSON: Perhaps he's going to come and identify his handwriting on the package.
MR LAMEY: Unfortunately not.
CHAIRPERSON: Very well, do you agree that we interpose Bellingan.
