Special Report Transcript Episode 42, Section 2, Time 01:14

Dumisa Ntsebeza, let me ask you the first question. We’ve had a lot of policemen in front of the Amnesty Committee, we’ve heard a lot of evidence in the human rights violations hearings about the police and security police, where is the military in all this? Why haven’t we made a breakthrough into the military? // Well, there are several reasons why we haven’t. I think one of the reasons is that we don’t have the capacity to investigate as much as we would want to. // Is that a flaw? Can’t you correct that? // Well, as I’ve said previously to other people who ask that question if I had 60 more investigators, I would still need investigators. Just to give you an indication of what the problems are. There was an occasion when we wanted certain specific documents from the military, we were not exactly sure what documents they are but we knew that they are between a certain time period and a certain time period. And what we were told is that if the documents were to be put one next to the other, they would be 84 kilometres long so we have to do a lot of homework and research to exactly know what exactly we want to be focusing on in order for us to make a significant breakthrough. There have been disclosures that have come in the very recent past but unfortunately I can’t disclose that now. // But can you tell us that there will be CCB people soon and there will be Directorate Covert Collection people soon or will those remain under the cloak? // Well I think most of these things are general knowledge. I mean, all the names of the CCB operatives are known. The Harms Commission touched on them, the Goldstone Commission touched on them. I mean they are popular names, or notorious names, depending on your viewpoint. Ferdi Barnard, the rest of them. They are all known, but the problem has always been whether the information that we have about them can be conveyed into evidence. There’s a difference. Information that cannot be authenticated remains information only. Some of them are rumours. But we are urging to get closer to that.

Notes: Max du Preez; Dumisa Ntsebeza

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