amntrans AMNESTY HEARING 1998-07-31 PRETORIA 10 DAWID JACOBUS BRITS https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=52743&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/amntrans/1998/98072031_pre_cosatu10.htm MR ROSSOUW Mr Chairman, I will then call my next applicant, Mr Dawid Brits. You will find his application in Volume 2, page 220. DAWID JACOBUS BRITS (sworn states) MR ROSSOUW Mr Chairman, at the outset - I've also handed to the Committee and everybody present an annexure to the Amnesty Application which you will find on page 220. This is just setting out in detail supplementing the application, the handwritten application that you will find on page 220 and further. CHAIRPERSON 220(a). EXAMINATION BY MR ROSSOUW Thank you Mr Chairman. Mr Brits, I refer you to page 220 of Volume 2, do you have that before you? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Mr Brits, do you confirm the content thereof in as far as paragraph 1 - 6 is concerned? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Paragraph 7(a) were you an official or a supporter of any political organisation? MR BRITS I served the Government of the day. MR ROSSOUW Is it correct when I say that you also supported the National Party? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW So you were a supporter of the National Party. Do you confirm the contents of paragraph 8? MR BRITS That is correct. CHAIRPERSON Is it quite correct that if a policeman says I support the government of the day say he supports the party or is he saying I support the government of my country? MR ROSSOUW Mr Chairman, that's why I asked whether he also supported the Nationalist Party, but there is a distinction. Mr Brits, then with regard to your involvement in the Cosatu House bomb explosion you are requesting amnesty as set out in the annexure page 220(a) you request amnesty for your involvement in the bomb explosion and any damage to property and damage to Cosatu House as well as any offences arising from the evidence which you will give? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW It is common cause that the explosion took place in 1987 in Johannesburg? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Regarding your own involvement in the operation you state that your order was received from Colonel de Kock. You also state that after the operation Brigadier Schoon was present at Vlakplaas and you inferred from that that the operation had enjoyed his approval? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You yourself was not tasked with any observation or gathering of information tasks before the operation but you do know about the observation that was carried out by means of helicopter as well as the photos that were taken? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You also state that Colonel de Kock expressly stated it to you that there should be no loss of life during this operation MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW And during the intelligence sessions you also became aware of the existence of the printing press in the building? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW And that the printing press should be rendered unusable and that the activities of COSATU should be halted? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You say that your specific task with regard to the operation would be to keep the area surrounding the building clean along with other members from Vlakplaas so that anybody who could possibly be on the street could be removed and not be injured as a result of the explosion? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You also mention on page 5 of the affidavit that you can remember the names of the person who were involved? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You state that on the particular evening you travelled in a mini bus from Vlakplaas to Johannesburg, can you remember that a gathering was held in Honeydew? MR BRITS No. MR ROSSOUW You say that you arrived at Cosatu House and that you climbed out of the vehicle and patrolled the area surrounding the building on foot? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Were you armed? MR BRITS Yes. MR ROSSOUW You've already testified that Colonel de Kock had stated that no person should be injured during the operation, did you have an instruction that anybody should be shot should they arrive on the scene? MR BRITS No. MR ROSSOUW You also state that you did not see how the other members penetrated the Cosatu House building but that you withdrew after a while and waited a short distance away for the explosion MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW The other members who were involved in the operation are mentioned in paragraph 1.1, you say that after the explosion you saw Captain Zeelie on television and that is also where you recollection springs from that he could be involved in the COSATU House incident? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Page 6 paragraph 1.3 you also state that in your handwritten application that Lionel Snyman and Dries van Heerden's involvement, are you certain about the involvement? MR BRITS No. MR ROSSOUW It is a mistake that you made to mention them in your handwritten application? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You also mention the braai that was held at Vlakplaas after the incident and that ex-Minister Vlok paid a visit during which he expressed his congratulations? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You also state that no persons as far as you know were seriously injured or killed and that the building was injured and that the operation had been a success? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You did not draw any financial benefit or remuneration from the incident except for the fact that a braai was held at Vlakplaas after the operation? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Mr Brits, during the trial here you heard the evidence which was given by General van der Merwe, ex-Minister Vlok about the political objective of this operation? MR BRITS Yes, I did hear the evidence. MR ROSSOUW Do you reconcile yourself with that and are you in agreement with this? MR BRITS Yes that is correct. MR ROSSOUW MR BRITS Yes that is correct. MR ROSSOUW You also say that your involvement emanated from an order which was given by Colonel de Kock? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You believed that this action against Cosatu House was aimed at the ANC which was the enemy so that their operational activities could be halted and more specifically so that the revolutionary material which was distributed as a result of the printing press which was used could be halted? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW The operation was also aimed at creating confusion between Cosatu and the ANC? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW You have already confirmed that your involvement was a result of an order from Colonel de Kock and that you participated directly under his command? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Mr Brits, finally on page 8 of the annexure in the final paragraph, you confirm the content thereof and request that the Committee take note of this? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW More specifically that since you have resigned from the Police you have had numerous medical problems, that you have a weak medical condition that you have been diagnosed with cancer and that in January last year you underwent an operation and that you are currently still receiving treatment for your condition? MR BRITS That is correct. MR ROSSOUW Mr Chairman, that's the evidence for the applicant. NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR ROSSOUW MR VISSER Visser on record Mr Chairman, I have no questions. NO QUESTIONS BY MR VISSER CHAIRPERSON No questions from any applicants. ADV DE JAGER Mr Brits do you know Mr Willemse? MR BRITS That is correct. ADV DE JAGER Did he participate with you in that operation or one of the operations or both operations? MR BRITS He participated with me in one of the operations. ADV DE JAGER Do you know exactly what he did? MR BRITS No, I don't know. MR ROSSOUW Mr Chairman just relating to that question, Mr Brits is only applying for one incident, Cosatu House, whereas Mr Willemse is applying for both, Cosatu and Khotso House. CHAIRPERSON No questions, thank you. WITNESS EXCUSED