amntrans AMNESTY HEARINGS 1999-09-29 PRETORIA 3 LARRY JOHN HANTON https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=53719&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/amntrans/1999/9909271005_pre_990929pt.htm MR NEL Mr Chairperson, I would like to call my client, I think if I could just move seats, Mr Hanton, and his application is found on page 90 of the bundle, and I've placed before you, Mr Chairperson, also an additional affidavit signed by Mr Hanton here this morning. I believe this will be Exhibit K, if I may. Thank you, Sir. MR SIBANYONI Your full names please. LARRY JOHN HANTON EXAMINATION BY MR NEL Thank you, Mr Chairperson. Mr Hanton, you are an applicant for amnesty, and your application is filed and found on page 90 of the bundle and you have read that once again, do you confirm the correctness thereof? MR HANTON I do, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL I've also drafted an affidavit on your behalf which is marked Exhibit K, if I may refer you to that as we go along. On the first page in the first few paragraphs, up to paragraph 5, you give a brief outline of your background in the South African Police Services, is that correct? MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL You also state that you had the opportunity to peruse the applications of the other applicants in this matter and you also refreshed your memory again. MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Briefly, on page ...(intervention) CHAIRPERSON Can I interrupt at this stage and merely put something on record. Paragraph 5, you talk about the Security Branch Camperdown, was that the farm at Camperdown? MR NEL That is correct. From Vlakplaas, Mr Hanton was transferred to the Durban so-called Vlakplaas, which was under Col Taylor at Camperdown, Mr Chairperson. CHAIRPERSON Thank you. MR NEL In paragraph 8, Mr Hanton, you set out that your amnesty application, when you drew that up your memory was very vague and already before this or at a previous hearing, documentation has been handed in to prove that you suffer from post-traumatic stress disorder and this might be a reason for your lack of memory. MR HANTON That is correct. MR NEL Do you confirm that? MR HANTON I confirm that, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL But you however, respectfully submit that all along you've made an attempt to make a full disclosure. MR HANTON Correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Now if we may move on to paragraph 10. Immediately you say there that originally you were under the impression that four people were killed, but having heard the evidence and having read the other applications, you realised that only three members, or three people were in fact killed in Swaziland. MR HANTON That's correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL And you also made a mistake with the date in your application when you said it might have been in 1987 or '88, but we know now it's common cause that the incident actually happened on the 12th of February '89. MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Then from paragraph 11 onwards you refer to submissions by Gen van der Merwe and also you have gone through a judgment in the matter of Cronje. You also refer in paragraph 12 to what serves before this Committee as Exhibit A and also you have read the documentation and the evidence which was led by Col de Kock during the initial Vlakplaas, may I call it the Cluster 1, regarding Vlakplaas and how it operated. MR HANTON Correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL And do you also ask that that be incorporated as part of your amnesty application? MR HANTON Correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Paragraph 14, Mr Hanton, you deal with the incident in question, where you received instructions from Col de Kock regarding what you had to do, and you say there that you believed that the authority to take part in the operation, emanated from higher authority. MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL And that fits in with the general manner in which instructions were conveyed to Vlakplaas. MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Paragraph 15, you mention a couple of names of people who might have been on Vlakplaas when the instructions were given, but you cannot remember all the members present. MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Then you deal further on with the incident and you believe that, you accept that the main mission was to eliminate these people, that you were instructed to do so. MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL You were also tasked with loading the kombi or the minibus with the weaponry, is that correct? MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL And a previous applicant, Bellingan then left with the minibus for Swaziland? MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL The paragraph there onwards on page 8, deals with the incident and you confirm the correctness of Col de Kock's evidence as to how the operation took place and, do you confirm that? MR HANTON I do, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL After the operation was successfully finalised, the following morning you and Bellingan left with the very same vehicle back to South Africa? MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL To shorten the proceedings, Mr Hanton, in paragraph 28 you respectfully submit that you've complied with all the provisions of the Amnesty Act, and you set out fully in paragraph 28(a) to (h), why you say so. You confirm pages 10 and 11 as well? MR HANTON I confirm that, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Mr Hanton, is it then so that you apply for amnesty for the conspiracy to murder these three people and any other offence or delict that might flow from this particular incident? MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. MR NEL Thank you, Mr Chairman, that is the evidence. NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR NEL MR HATTINGH Hattingh, Mr Chairman, I have no questions thank you. NO QUESTIONS BY MR HATTINGH MR BOOYENS Booyens, no questions, Mr Chairman. NO QUESTIONS BY MR BOOYENS MR CORNELIUS Cornelius, Mr Chairman, no questions thank you. NO QUESTIONS BY MR CORNELIUS MR ROSSOUW Rossouw, Mr Chairman, no questions. NO QUESTIONS BY MR ROSSOUW MR BOTHA Botha, Mr Chairman, no questions. NO QUESTIONS BY MR BOTHA MR VISSER Visser, Mr Chairman, no questions, thank you. NO QUESTIONS BY MR VISSER MR VAN HEERDEN Van Heerden, Mr Chairman, no questions. NO QUESTIONS BY MR VAN HEERDEN ADV STEENKAMP No questions, thank you Mr Chairman. NO QUESTIONS BY ADV STEENKAMP MR SIBANYONI Just one question. Did you, Mr Hanton, also book in at the Smoky Valley Resort? MR HANTON I did, Mr Chairperson. MR SIBANYONI If you were supposed to come back to South Africa the same day, why was it necessary to book in at the resort? MR HANTON Mr Chairperson, I can't remember the exact circumstances at that time. MR SIBANYONI Thank you. ADV SANDI No questions, Mr Chairman, thank you. CHAIRPERSON Do you remember trying to cross the border that night? MR HANTON I do, Mr Chairperson. CHAIRPERSON And you couldn't do it because of the weather conditions, the mud on ... MR HANTON That is correct, Mr Chairperson. CHAIRPERSON Re-examination? MR NEL No re-examination, Mr Chairman. NO RE-EXAMINATION BY MR NEL MR NEL May my client be excused under the same conditions, Sir? CHAIRPERSON Certainly. MR HANTON Thank you, Mr Chairperson. WITNESS EXCUSED