amntrans AMNESTY HEARINGS 1999-11-15 PRETORIA 1 IZAK DANIEL BOSCH https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=53893&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/amntrans/1999/9911151210_pre_991115pt.htm MR SIBANYONI What are your full names, Mr Bosch? IZAK DANIEL BOSCH (sworn states) MR SIBANYONI Sworn in, Chairperson. EXAMINATION BY MR LAMEY Mr Bosch, you are applying before this Committee, for amnesty for your involvement in the attempted murder and then also the conspiracy to murder Dirk Coetzee. Is it correct that there was an initial amnesty application which you submitted on the 18th of November 1996, which we can find from pages 76 to page 82 of bundle 1 before the Committee? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And that is before you obtained legal representation? MR BOSCH Yes, that is correct. MR LAMEY Now with that initial application there was an annexure which was typed, which can be found from page 83 to 88, is that correct? MR BOSCH Yes, that is correct. MR LAMEY Furthermore, after you had obtained legal representation, a further supplementary document of particulars was provided with regard to this particular incident, which we can then find from page 91 up to and including page 94, is that correct? MR BOSCH Yes, that is correct. MR LAMEY You were also a State witness in the trial of Mr de Kock, and in the bundle, in bundle 2, we have an extract of your evidence during that trial, pertaining to the death of Bheki Mlangeni and also the attempted murder of Dirk Coetzee, of which Mr de Kock was charged. MR BOSCH Yes, that is correct. MR LAMEY As far as it concerns the particulars that you provided during the de Kock trial, you would request the Committee also considers this as relevant to your application. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Chairperson, I just want to mention that on page 91, the offences and/or the acts that he is applying amnesty for, I will deal further with that in my submissions, but the intention is also here to ask for conspiracy to murder Mr Dirk Coetzee. That has not been mentioned thusfar in the supplemented papers on page 91. Mr Bosch, you state that during 1990 you received an order from Col de Kock, what was your rank at that stage? MR BOSCH I received an order and I had the rank of Sergeant. MR LAMEY And did you have any particular training at Vlakplaas? I know the documents mention that you received technical training, demolitions training. MR BOSCH Yes, I underwent demolitions training as well as certain technical training, but I was largely self taught. MR LAMEY And according to your affidavit, you state that you received an order to manufacture a package bomb, with the objective of sending it to Dirk Coetzee. MR BOSCH Yes, that is correct. MR LAMEY And prior to this, were you at any stage involved in the tapping or the listening to tapes which were obtained by means of tapping the movements of Mr Coetzee? MR BOSCH We observed the movements of Mr Coetzee's wife in order to see whether or not she would make any contact with him. This was by means of surveillance and tapping. MR LAMEY This was before you received this particular order. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And when you received the order, were you aware of the whereabouts of Mr Coetzee? MR BOSCH We suspected that he was in Zambia. MR LAMEY Did you yourself have the capacity at Vlakplaas to give execution to this order? MR BOSCH No. MR LAMEY And when you received the order from Mr de Kock, were any particulars conveyed to you with regard to the package bomb and what specifically it was supposed to entail? MR BOSCH No, not at that stage. I said that I would go to the Technical Division to find out whether or not they could assist us. MR LAMEY And when you refer to the Technical Division, what do you refer to? MR BOSCH The Technical Division of the Security Police. MR LAMEY Did you then go there? MR BOSCH Yes. MR LAMEY Where was it situated? MR BOSCH In Rebecca Street, Pretoria West. MR LAMEY Very well. And who did you approach there? MR BOSCH I approached Capt Japie Kok, upon which we went to Col Waal du Toit and directed the request to him. MR LAMEY Can you recall whether it was Col Waal du Toit at that stage? MR BOSCH Yes, that is correct. MR LAMEY Can you recall whether or not he knew about the order at that stage? What is your recollection about that? MR BOSCH At that stage he didn't know, but I have just found out that Mr de Kock had already consulted with Mr du Toit. MR LAMEY You state that it was decided to send a cassette player to Mr Coetzee, of which the earphones would contain explosives. Can you explain how this took place? Did Mr de Kock mentioned anything to you about a portable cassette player with earphones, or when did this come under discussion? MR BOSCH After a few days, Japie Kok contacted me, it was either Japie or Kobus, I cannot remember precisely who, they told me to buy two walkmans. MR LAMEY Japie and Kobus, are they brothers? MR BOSCH Yes. MR LAMEY And their request to you was to buy two walkmans? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Did you then do so? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Where did you purchase these items? MR BOSCH At Philtron in du Toit Street in Pretoria. MR LAMEY Which funds did you use to purchase these items? MR BOSCH I instituted a false claim from the secret fund to obtain the money. MR LAMEY Was this a secret fund which was at the disposal of Vlakplaas? MR BOSCH Yes, at the disposal of Vlakplaas and the entire Security Force. MR LAMEY Now when you refer to a false claim, do you mean that the true particulars for the purpose of the acquisition were never conveyed in the claim itself? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY When you were supposed to purchase these portable cassette players or walkmans, is it correct - firstly, let me ask you, is it correct that it was the walkman type of cassette player? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Was it at that stage clear that this would be the instrument which would be used? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And then you returned both of these items to the Technical Division. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY May I just ask you, at that stage did you have any particulars pertaining to an address to which this bomb was supposed to be sent? MR BOSCH No, Chairperson, my purpose was to facilitate between the technical and somebody was appointed for sending the package. MR LAMEY Who was this? MR BOSCH Riaan Bellingan. MR LAMEY Very well. And where did the further manufacture and composition of this so-called package bomb with the portable cassette player take place? MR BOSCH In Rebecca Street, Pretoria West. MR LAMEY At the Technical Division? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And with whom did you liaise further there, to maintain contact regarding the progress? MR BOSCH First with Japie Kok and then Kobus Kok. MR LAMEY Was he later the contact person? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And at that stage did you make any enquiries regarding the progress? MR BOSCH Yes, I did. Every second or third day I would visit the Technical Division to see whether or not the package was ready and what the progress was regarding this instruction. MR LAMEY Was anything said to you at a later stage that is was ready, but that the Technical Division needed to test it first? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Did you have a particular request in this regard, to assist with the testing of it? MR BOSCH That is correct, I was requested to purchase a sheep's head, or at least I suggest that we test in on a sheep's head. I don't know exactly what the situation was, but when I visited the butchery I saw that the sheep's head was too expensive and that is why I purchased a pig's head. MR LAMEY And where would this test run take place? MR BOSCH At the shooting range at Vlakplaas. MR LAMEY And who was to attend it? MR BOSCH It would have been me and then Col Waal would also have been present, as well as Japie and Kobus. But I must just add that at a certain stage during the criminal trial, I wasn't really certain of who was present, whether it was Kobus or Japie, but one of them was present. MR LAX Sorry. Could you just repeat who was present at the testing? MR BOSCH Col Waal du Toit, Willie Nortje and I think it was Japie. MR LAX Thank you, please continue. MR LAMEY Thank you. May I just ask you, Willie Nortje also knew - as far as you know, he also knew about this planning. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Do you know whether he received any instruction pertaining to the execution thereof? MR BOSCH No. MR LAMEY And was this testing conducted at Vlakplaas? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And where at Vlakplaas did this take place? MR BOSCH The shooting range. It was about three-quarters of a kilometre away from the house, adjacent to the river next to the mountain. MR LAMEY Was the test successful? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Can you explain how the explosives functioned with regard to the testing, where were they situated? MR BOSCH It was in the headphones. The explosives were placed inside the headphones. MR LAMEY And how was it detonated? MR BOSCH With a cable. MR LAMEY Very well. And after the test run, you reported the success of the test to Col de Kock. MR BOSCH That is correct. I cannot recall whether it was on the same day or the next day, because he wasn't present at the shooting range. MR LAX Sorry, just that I couldn't help but notice that none of you are wearing your headphones. MR LAMEY Now after this test, can you recall for how long the package was ready? MR BOSCH About a week afterwards. MR LAMEY Did you then go to the Technical Division? MR BOSCH Yes, I went to the Technical Division, Kobus was busy wrapping it up and I assisted him in wrapping it. MR LAMEY Did you use gloves? MR BOSCH Yes, we both wore gloves. MR LAMEY Did you assist him with the final packaging of the package? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Do you know anything about cassettes which were to be purchased? MR BOSCH That is correct. Bellingan told me that I had to buy cassettes, that he liked BZN and Neil Diamond. That is at the OK Bazaars that I purchased the tapes. MR LAMEY There was music on these tapes, did you also give these tapes to the Technical Division? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And after the package had been wrapped and this was finalised, can you recall whether any address was placed on the wrapping when you became involved in the final wrapping of the package? MR BOSCH At the stage when we had finished wrapping the package, nothing had been written on it as yet. I cannot recall whether I took it with me that very same day or whether someone delivered it at the farm. I'm not certain about that, but the next thing that I can recall, I can see this clearly in my mind's eye, the package was ready, the address was on, it was standing in the office, the address had been written on in a thick black koki pen. MR LAMEY Did you notice what was written on the package? MR BOSCH No, I didn't. MR LAMEY Now this office that you had - you had an office at Vlakplaas? MR BOSCH Yes, that is correct. MR LAMEY Was this off limits to certain members, was it some form of a security office that you could lock? MR BOSCH Yes, it could be locked, but it wasn't that it was off limits to anyone. If I was in the office they were free to enter because there was equipment inside and sometimes the equipment would disappear and I would have to replace it. MR LAMEY Who kept the keys to this office? MR BOSCH Mr de Kock had a set of keys, as well as me. MR LAMEY And you state that at a certain stage you can recall that you saw the package in the office and at that stage the address was written on the package. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Do you know what happened to it subsequently? MR BOSCH I told Col de Kock that the package was ready, I think I also told Bellingan that the package was ready and that it could be posted. MR LAMEY Do you know whether the particulars of the address of where it was supposed to go as well as the address of the sender, was ever at your disposal at Vlakplaas, as far as you know? MR BOSCH It was never at my disposal, I don't know whether it was at the disposal of any of the other members, perhaps they were waiting for an address, I don't know where the address came from. MR LAMEY On page 92 there is a section of the affidavit which follows "The address of Dirk Coetzee was provided by Security Head Office" And then it reads further - "After the package had been sent, it appeared that it was not fetched by Dirk Coetzee at the post office in Lusaka, that it had been back to the sender's address which was given as that of Bheki Mlangeni, that he was an operative for the ANC and so forth." Is this firsthand knowledge that you stated in your affidavit, or is it not firsthand knowledge? MR BOSCH I listened to the tapes of the discussions which took place when the lines were tapped, so the address did not come from those tapes. MR LAMEY The tapes that you listened to? MR BOSCH Yes. Then I would have known that it came from the farm, and it didn't come from the farm either. MR LAMEY You state that the address of Dirk Coetzee was given by Security Head Office. Can you recall where that statement of yours emanates from? MR BOSCH It would have been an assumption that I made, because what I mean is that it wasn't only us who were working on this project, there were others who were also collecting intelligence to launch this project with. MR LAMEY Then a further section of your statement which follows from there, is this information that you heard of subsequently? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And this was after the package bomb ultimately detonated in the hands of Bheki Mlangeni? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY You state that the cassette which was placed in the cassette player, was marked "Hit Squad - Evidence". Did you anything like that? Did you put that inscription on the tapes, which read to the effect of hit squads? MR BOSCH No. MR LAMEY Is this also information which came to light subsequently? MR BOSCH That is correct MR LAX Just while you're there, who would have written that on there? MR BOSCH To this very day I still don't know who wrote it on the tape. These are things which I heard after the fact and I can tell you why. One day I arrived in the canteen and I saw a BZN tape lying there and it looked exactly like the one which I had purchased and then I thought, why wasn't the cassette included, or perhaps someone had bought one similar to that, but I assumed that it was my cassette or at least the one that I had purchased. MR LAX Just remind me, who went to buy those cassettes? MR BOSCH I did it myself, Sir. MR LAX You bought them yourself? MR BOSCH That's right, yes. MR LAX And who did you give them to? MR BOSCH I gave it to Technical. MR LAX As part of your planning because you were the link with Technical, weren't you? MR BOSCH That's correct, yes, Sir. MR LAX Did you know the tape had to be marked "Hit Squad - Evidence"? MR BOSCH No, our original planning was for the two music cassettes to go in, that's all. The "Hit Squad Evidence", that was a fact that came later on, after the parcel was manufactured and in our possession. So somebody must have opened that thing again and put that in. That's my conclusion that I can make. I can't say it is a fact, but I think so. MR LAX Well let me ask you this. You were there when it was sealed. MR BOSCH That's correct, at Rebecca Street. MR LAX And there were two tapes there. MR BOSCH That's correct. MR LAX One was a Neil Diamond tape. MR BOSCH And one BZN. MR LAX And one was a BZN tape. MR BOSCH That's correct, ja. MR LAX And you don't know how this other tape got in there. MR BOSCH No. MR LAX The other thing, just while we're on this issue, you said that the writing on the thing was in koki pen. MR BOSCH If my recollection is correct, I recall that it was a thick black koki pen which had been used to write on that paper. MR LAX We've already heard evidence though that the writing on the parcel was mostly a computer print-out. MR BOSCH No, I don't know, I can recall black. MR LAX The addresses and so on. And that only a little bit of it was in koki pen. MR BOSCH I can remember because I did not take it out of the packet, because I didn't want my fingerprints to go on it. I just looked into the thing and I saw there was writing on the packet. MR LAX Yes. But you heard the evidence earlier. MR BOSCH Yes, I did, Sir. MR LAX Yes. We're talking about two different parcels here it seems. MR BOSCH No, one parcel, Sir. MR LAX We're talking about two different coverings. MR BOSCH That's a possibility, that I cannot deny. MR LAMEY But did you note what was written in black koki pen? MR BOSCH I didn't read it, I simply looked into the bag and left it at that. MR LAMEY Was the package in another bag? MR BOSCH Yes, it was in a white plastic bag. MR LAMEY Mr Bosch, then furthermore you stated on page 93 to 94 what according to you the political objective was. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And then with regard to the order or approval, you stated that you received the order from Col Eugene de Kock. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY May I just ask you this. Do you have any direct evidence indicating that this order came from head office? MR BOSCH No, I just assumed that if Col de Kock gave me the order, he received it from head office. MR LAMEY And did Col de Kock as far as you know, have daily liaison with head office? MR BOSCH Yes, he would have gone to Sanhedrin every day if he was in the area. MR LAMEY Did you believe subjectively that such type of an order would have been regularly cleared with head office? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Thank you, Chairperson, as far as I recall - Just one further aspect, Mr Bosch, before I finish off. Did you receive any additional remuneration with the exception of your regular salary, for your share in this incident? MR BOSCH No. MR LAMEY In the initial application, in the hand-written section on page 18, mention is made of bonus and cash, is that a general statement that you made, but which is not of application to this particular matter? MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY And the incidents for which you have applied, during which such additional remuneration was paid out, you have stated as such in your supplementary evidence. MR BOSCH That is correct. MR LAMEY Thank you, Chairperson, that is the evidence-in-chief. NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR LAMEY CHAIRPERSON What time tomorrow morning, gentlemen? Nine thirty. Very well, we will now adjourn till nine thirty tomorrow morning. MS LOCKHAT All rise. COMMITTEE ADJOURNS