amntrans AMNESTY HEARINGS 2000-02-02 PRETORIA 2 EDWARD THEISE MOKATI https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=54021&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/amntrans/2000/200202pt.htm CHAIRPERSON Your next witness Mr Koopedi? MR KOOPEDI Thank you Chairperson, Honourable Committee Members, the next applicant is Mr Mokati, he is number two on the list. He is before you and I believe he is ready to be sworn in? CHAIRPERSON Yes, his statement will then be Exhibit B, the written statement. MR KOOPEDI Yes, we will mark it accordingly as Exhibit B. EDWARD THEISE MOKATI (sworn states) EXAMINATION BY MR KOOPEDI Thank you Madame Chair. Mr Mokati, is it correct that you are an applicant in this matter, the incident that has been referred to as the Vanderbijlpark Bus Terminus and also the Naladi Power Station? MR MOKATI That is correct. MR KOOPEDI I refer you to page 11 of the bundle of documents which is before the Honourable Committee, is this your application form? MR MOKATI That is correct, that's my application form. MR KOOPEDI On page 13 at the bottom thereof, there is a signature on this application form, is it your signature? MR MOKATI That's my signature, that's correct. MR KOOPEDI You have been prepared a statement which has been labelled Exhibit B for facilitation of these proceedings, would you read this statement? MR MOKATI I will do so. "I joined the ANC in 1986 and underwent military training in Angola. In 1987 I became a member of special ops and was infiltrated into the country in 1987. My mandate included recruiting for the ANC" ...(intervention) MR KOOPEDI Mr Mokati, I would ask you to read a little slowly for the interpreters and the Honourable Committee Members to follow? MR MOKATI Okay. "I joined the ANC in 1986. My mandate included recruiting for the ANC, training in army units for ...(indistinct) operations. During 1988 I met with co-applicant ...(intervention)" CHAIRPERSON 1987. MR MOKATI: "1987, Mr Dube, in Soweto. He was a commander senior to me and had his own operating unit. One day we entered into a discussion about my unit's activities. I confirm what he has said in his evidence in chief where he relates to me. I wish to point out that since this was my operation I made a final decision about the operation. Since I was commanding the operation, Mr Sipho Mthembu was to act on my orders. I, in line with my discussion with Mr Dube, and after reconnoitring the bus terminus decided that a concrete which was inside the terminus would be a suitable place to detonate that mine with minimal damages. The concrete ceiling was the thickest of them all and it would be able to confine and suppress the shock waves. During September 1988 I went to town at Johannesburg together with Mr Sipho Mthembu. We proceeded to the Vanderbijlpark bus terminus and I was carrying the limpet mine. We went into a public toilet in the area and I armed the limpet mine. I used a ...(indistinct) which is supposed to trigger the explosive after 30 minutes. I then proceeded to the big concrete building and put the limpet mine inside. We then went across the street and waited for the explosion. The explosion did not occur after 30 minutes as expected and after one hour had passed I started to panic and wanted to go back to the concrete building and remove the mine. I however did not remove the limpet after what could have been close to two hours from the time of arming the limpet. The ....(indistinct) explosion occurred. We then departed and left the area. During September 1988 I went together with Mr Sipho Mthembu to Naladi Power Station. I had in my possession a limpet mine. We cut the fence and we went inside. I then armed the limpet and we departed. I then heard an explosion. I was arrested, charged and convicted with treason and sentenced to 14 years. I was released in 1991." MR KOOPEDI Chairperson, that will be the evidence in chief for this applicant. NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR KOOPEDI CHAIRPERSON Yes. Was Mr Sipho Mthembu involved in any way whatsoever in the Vanderbijlpark Bus Terminus incident or did you do that operation all by yourself? MR MOKATI Yes Mr Sipho Mthembu was involved. CHAIRPERSON He was involved. MR KOOPEDI May I, in that instance Chairperson, refer you to the fourth paragraph from the bottom of his statement where he refers to? CHAIRPERSON Thank you. Mr Steenkamp, I take it that you are adopting the same attitude with regard to Mr Dube? MR STEENKAMP Yes thank you Madame Chair. CHAIRPERSON Thank you. Advocate de Jager? JUDGE DE JAGER No. CHAIRPERSON Sorry, Judge de Jager. Judge Motata? JUDGE MOTATA I've got none Madame Chair. CHAIRPERSON Thank you. Mr Koopedi, you won't be daring us to want to re-examine? MR KOOPEDI I would not be allowed to re-examine even if I wanted to, that would be his evidence in chief and we are not calling any other witness for his application. CHAIRPERSON Yes. Mr Mokati, you may step down as a witness. Your next witness Mr Koopedi? WITNESS EXCUSED