hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS, SUBMISSIONS QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 1996-09-24 DUNCAN VILLAGE 2 NOMASONTO KUMALO https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55063&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/duncan/kumalo.htm REVD FINCA: We are going to bring forward Ms Nomasonto Kumalo. You behaved well yesterday, the whole day and even today. Now, this is the person next to the last one. I would like you to behave, because we started well, so we should end this hearing well. Can you please be quiet and we should give respect to the two people, thank you. REVD XUNDU Thank you Mr Chairman. I would like them to take an oath. NOMASONTO KUMALO (sworn states) REVD XUNDU Is the other lady going to swear, or is she just going to accompany you? N KUMALO No she can't speak. REVD XUNDU Thank you. To you Mr Chairman. REVD FINCA We welcome you Ms Nomasonto Kumalo. We thank you for coming here in front of this Commission with three issues concerning you, Vuyelwa Kumalo and Nomakhosazana Kumalo. Ms Maya is going to ask you questions MS MAYA Thank you Mr Chairman. I would like to greet you Ms Kumalo. You came, you brought a set story in front of this Commission about your mother and your sister and you saw your house being burnt and you saw both of them die. They died in front of you. Can you please tell us about your family first. DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 2 N KUMALO N KUMALO Vuyelwa Edith Kumalo is my mother, she was a teacher here in Duncan Village. MS MAYA Can you please come nearer to the mike. N KUMALO Edith Vuyelwa Kumalo who was my mother, she was a teacher here in Duncan Village and it was her last year before she pensioned. Nomakhosazana is my older sister, we all stayed together in our home, together with my child and she was three years old at that time. She is the one sitting next to me. MS MAYA Is your child Ayabulela? N KUMALO Yes. MS MAYA Were you any member of a political organisation at home? N KUMALO Yes, I was a member of a youth organisation in Duncan Village. MS MAYA What about your mother and your older sister? N KUMALO No, they were not involved, especially my mother. MS MAYA In the statement in front of us, we see that you are speaking of a feud between AZAPO and UDF and you said your family was accused of being AZAPO members. Can you please tell us about that? N KUMALO At that time here in Duncan Village, if you see something wrong being done by the youth, something not good for example, there was a tendency that if one was drunk, he was given OMO to drink and if you tried to stop people from doing that, people were accusing you of being an AZAPO member. Secondly I was called at the People's Court by my next door neighbours, Duraxaba was one of them, they called me to the People's Court and they accused me of being an AZAPO member and in 1971 I had an affair with a member of the DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 3 N KUMALO security. There is a guy who said he's got information about me, and then I asked them how old was I in 1971, but they couldn't answer me. All the people tried to stop this Mr Sizane was there in the People's Court and he said we are not there to accuse someone about something she didn't do. On another occasion while I was at work, there was a lady who came to me and she said to me, it was on Christmas Eve, she said to me Nomasonto, your home is going to be burnt and I went home, I said to my mother she must take the children together with her, my child and my sister's child, I told her to go home at her home. MS MAYA Without disturbing you, who was the lady who told you this? N KUMALO ; I think I should keep her name, I will say it privately. MS MAYA Okay. REVD FINCA People, I've already said that you've behaved yourselves yesterday and even today. This evidence, although you are listening to it, is directed to us as the Commission and according to our law one has a right that if she doesn't want to put someone's life in danger, she cannot say the word, she can say someone's name in private, so please don't disturb our work, the Commission's work. We have rules which we work under, so please allow us to follow those rules. If there is someone here who doesn't accept that, it is that person's right to leave here, but now we have to give this witness the right. MS MAYA Without disturbing you, when you were told that your house is going to be burnt, did they burn it? N KUMALO No, they didn't burn it at that time. I asked DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 4 N KUMALO this lady who are these people who are going to burn my house, she told me that she just heard that there was list of people who which - their houses are going to be burnt and she said she saw (indistinct) and I went back home and told my mother to go back home in Ndebe. I came here to Duncan Village and I met Joe Jordan together with one other comrade and I told him that someone said my home is going to be burnt and I can't stand this victimisation any more, I would go to the police and report this to the police. Joe said to me, told me not to go to the police. He said that people will accuse me if I go to the police. MS MAYA What happened in short? N KUMALO He called Dudunaba and he called him to the meeting in Duncan Village. Dudu asked me who told me this and then I said I am not going to tell you who told me and he said that he didn't say this. They told Dudu that if anything happened to my house, Dudu will have to answer that. MS MAYA Let us now come to the 4th of March 1986. What happened on that day? N KUMALO At night, on that day we were sleeping. While we were sleeping, my mother woke me up. She was woken up by stones which were thrown to the house and we had to wake up. We were used to this, because people used to break windows at my home, but we couldn't see who were these people. I went outside on that day, I went to the lounge on that day and there was a confusion at that time, because all the windows were thrown by the stones. I went to the kitchen, I could smell the strong smell of petrol. The door couldn't open, it was locked. I said DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 5 N KUMALO to my sister, Nomakhosazana, please open the door, so that they can come in. MS MAYA Why didn't the doors open? N KUMALO I don't know, even today. While we were still looking at this situation, I peeped through the window and I saw many people and I could recognise some of them, because the live at the same street. I also went to the back window and then I saw one with a petrol gallon, it is Maqotinala Xonti. I went to my mother's room where my child was sleeping and I could see the fire. The fire was in the same room in which my mother was sleeping. And my mother was hit by fire that time, and I took the child to the lounge. And the fire went through the house at that time, there were no burglar proofs fortunately, because they had to be repaired. So I managed to go out with the window with my child. I wrapped her with a duvet and then I came back, I left the child outside and the walls were falling down at that time and then I met my mother, she was down at that time, near the door of the lounge and the fire was too strong at that time. I looked for my sister, her hair was burning and I tried to take my sister out, and I succeeded to do that. What surprised me is that my neighbours came and they tried to help us. But one of the neighbours - he was complaining because he said that his house is going to be burnt too. People tried to help us, they gave us water. I didn't know at that time that I was also burning. I tried to help DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 6 N KUMALO my mother and they helped us, they gave us blankets, they wrapped us with the blankets, the neighbours tried to do that. One of our neighbours who had a phone, and I am not going to mention the name, the neighbour phoned the ambulance and the police. MS MAYA At the time you went out through the window, where were these people you saw outside? N KUMALO No, they were not there at that time. MS MAYA Did you know who were there? Did you know these peoples' names? N KUMALO Yes, I do. One of them is Maqotinala Xonti, the other one is Tandile Nombeko, the third one is Ringo Fadele. MS MAYA ; Will you please raise your voice, because these names are being written here. N KUMALO Maqotinala Xonti, Tandile Nombeko the second one. And the third one is ringo Fadele. MS MAYA Are they still around now? N KUMALO Just because I'm not living here, I'm not staying here in Duncan Village, I'm not sure if they are still here. MS MAYA Were you taken to hospital? N KUMALO Yes, the ambulance came together with soldiers and they took us to the hospital. We slept over, on the next day my mother died at nine o'clock in the morning. It was on Wednesday, on Friday my sister died. MS MAYA What about you and your child? Where were you? N KUMALO We were still in hospital at that time. MS MAYA For how long did you stay there? N KUMALO I stayed for three weeks and I had to ask the Doctors to discharge me because I wanted to prepare for the funeral of my mother and my sister. My child stayed for two DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 7 N KUMALO months in hospital. MS MAYA Was the funeral peaceful? N KUMALO Yes, it was. The UDF members came to my house. They were trying to show us that they were not part of what was happening. Secondly they asked for our permission to explain to my family what happened, but I would like to apologise to the UDF members, because my family was bitter, my family was bitter at that time, they didn't agree, they didn't want to give them, they didn't give them platform to try and explain. We told them that the soldiers would beat everybody if the UDF members can make a speech at the funeral. MS MAYA The people you have mentioned, do you know which political organisation they belonged to? N KUMALO At that time everybody was a member of the UDF. MS MAYA After your home was burn, what happened to you and your child, where did you stay? N KUMALO We went to stay at my mother's home in Mnqesha where they were buried. MS MAYA Are you still living there? N KUMALO Yes. MS MAYA Were you working or were you a student at that time? N KUMALO I was working. MS MAYA Did you go back to work? N KUMALO No, I didn't. MS MAYA What happened? N KUMALO No, I couldn't go back to work. I used to have a part time job in King William's Town, even now I was working for the IEC here in East London, I also worked for the Government in Bisho, but I've stopped. DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 8 N KUMALO MS MAYA Is this having anything to do with what happened at your home IN 1986? N KUMALO yes. MS MAYA I am sure that your life changed since you saw this. Can you please tell us what happened to you life after you've witnesses all this? N KUMALO firstly I have a problem with my child because she doesn't understand what happened. She has many questions and she doesn't really understand what happened to her. She was a student in Thembasa one time, but now she is in De Vos Malan in King William's Town, because she came back one other day and then she told me that she doesn't want to go to school because the other children at school they laugh at her and today I want this people to see what they did to my child. I want them to see how my child is today because of them. MS MAYA You said in your statement your child cannot concentrate at school as a result you had to take your child to the class, to the special class for people with learning disabilities? N KUMALO Yes. MS MAYA Do you have any other thing you want to say? N KUMALO What I can say is that I want to say to the Watson Brothers who were here in town at that time, the comrades called them and the leader was Duranxaba. They wanted to know what was really happening in Duncan Village. And then they tried to explain, but they accused us of being witches and they said that my mother killed people. They gave (indistinct) and then the comrades told them to DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 9 N KUMALO leave us alone. MS MAYA When was this? N KUMALO It was in 1985, December 1985. MS MAYA Do you have any other thing you want to add? N KUMALO No, there is nothing. MS MAYA I'm sure that you have a request to the Truth Commission. Can you please tell us what is your request. N KUMALO My request to the Truth Commission is that I want this people to come forward. I don't have a grudge with them, the reason is that while my mother was still in hospital, she prayed to God and she gave her life to God. I think she forgave them, so I can't hold a grudge against them, because my mother didn't. Secondly, I would like the Truth Commission to take care of my child, maybe if she can have plastic surgery. MS MAYA One thing I left, how old was your sister Nomakhosazana? N KUMALO She was 31 years old. MS MAYA Is that all you want to say? N KUMALO Yes, that is all. MS MAYA Thank you. I will give this opportunity to the Chairman, maybe he's got questions. REVD FINCA Revd Xundu. REVD XUNDU Did Nomakhosazana have a child? N KUMALO Yes, the name of the child is Balisa. REVD XUNDU Is she at school? N KUMALO Yes, she is in De Vos Malan. REVD XUNDU Who looks after her? N KUMALO She lives with me, so I support her. REVD XUNDU So what do you say about this child to the Commission? DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 10 N KUMALO N KUMALO I also have a request about her. REVD XUNDU Thank you, Chairman. REVD FINCA Mr Sandi. MR SANDI Ms Kumalo, are you working at the moment? N KUMALO No, I am unemployed. MR SANDI Did you ever work before? N KUMALO Yes, the last job I was in Bisho in the Parliament. MR SANDI When did you stop? N KUMALO 1994. MR SANDI Did you have any other job? N KUMALO Yes. MR SANDI Thank you. REVD FINCA Thank you Ms Kumalo. I think your evidence reminded us that while we were still fighting for freedom, there were mistakes we did at the time we were struggling. There are things which happened that when we look back, we will feel embarrassed about them. We thank you for reminding us in this Duncan Village hearing in such a powerful manner of those mistakes. We thank you for clarifying that those who were leaders of people at that time, they tried to take action before this Commission. They tried to come and ask for forgiveness on behalf of those who did this. I think yesterday when Mr Jordan was submitting the report here, he touched on such events. He said that some of these events were done by people who claimed to be members of the African National Congress, and he asked for forgiveness for those things. We thank you for reminding us towards the end of this hearing, that the Human Rights were not only violated by the DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 11 oppressors, but within us, there were other people who were oppressing others. Your requests will be taken into consideration and we will follow whatever we have to follow because our aim is that we want South Africa to be peaceful and to have a better future. Things like this, we want to make things like this not to happen again in this country. Thank you very much, we also thank your daughter, who accompanied you so that we can see her. You can now go back to your place and we will now call the last witness, which is Zuko Galela and after that we will close the hearing.