hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS, SUBMISSIONS QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 1997-04-09 GRAHAMSTOWN 3 MAVA XOLELA RWEXU https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55148&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/gtown/rwexu.htm REVD XUNDU: Chairperson, I would like to swear him in, starting with Mava Zolela Rwexu. MAVA XOLELA RWEXU (sworn states) NOMAKHWEZI GEORGINA SIKO (sworn states) PATRICIA FUNDISWA SUKULA (sworn states) TENJIWE QUENETTE MADINDA (sworn states) REVD XUNDU Chairman, the witnesses had been duly sworn in. CHAIRMAN Have you all been sworn in? Who is the lady? MR RWEXU Mavis Siko. CHAIRMAN Are you also going to testify? MAVIS SIKO (sworn states) REVD XUNDU Thank you Chairman, they have all been sworn in. CHAIRMAN Ntisiki Sandi? ADV SANDI Mr Rwexu, could you please come closer to the microphone, so that we can hear you. In 1986, you house was set alight and am I correct that it was in Mphanthi township? MR RWEXU Yes, it was, that is correct. ADV SANDI Could you tell us very briefly what happened there and who the victims were who were burnt there? MR RWEXU I was not present when this incident took place Mr Chairman. When I got there, the place had already been burnt. When I came up the street where I stayed from M Street up Lelombo, it was at approximately 9 pm, the other houses' lights were on and I was wondering why my house was so dark. I was approaching by car and I though perhaps the people are sleeping already and then I wanted to know why this car, the police and soldiers cars were outside my house and when I got to my house, I saw that it was smoking. I was wondering what had happened. When I was going to get to my yard, the soldiers approached me and wanted to know what I was doing there and where I was going. I told them that I was coming home, that that was my house and they told me that my house had been set alight. They did not want to let me in, but I insisted because I was hoping to find, I wanted to see if there was anyone inside. I went in with a torch, it was dark in the house, it was still smoking and as I, when I got in by the door, I tripped over someone. When I shone the torch on that person, I realised that it was someone in my house, that stayed at my house, one of the children there. ADV SANDI Who was that? MR RWEXU It was Vuyiswa Hoboshe. Duzana Hoboshe was the policeman, was the lady who was, my sister who was a policewoman and because of that, the house was set alight. ADV SANDI Where was she staying? MR RWEXU She was staying at Juaza, at the police camp. ADV SANDI Is that the place that was called Mqundwandeni? Did the police tell you who had set your house alight? MR RWEXU No, I never heard who had set the house alight. ADV SANDI But there were some people who were seriously injured, some fatally injured. You already told us that the first person was Vuyiswa, who was the second person? MR RWEXU The second person is my mother and my sister's one child, three of them were fatally injured. ADV SANDI Did you hear of anyone being arrested? MR RWEXU I heard that people were arrested, but I never even went to court because I was never summonsed to court. And I don't know what happened, all I was told was that the police said to me that they would call me on the day of the trial. And afterwards I just heard that the matter had been finalised. ADV SANDI What did you hear about the sentences? MR RWEXU I never heard that they were sentenced, all I heard was that the matter had been finalised and only one of them had been convicted and I was not even interested in knowing what the sentence was. ADV SANDI What time do you think it was? MR RWEXU The whole house was burnt down, I don't know. ADV SANDI Did you receive any compensation? MR RWEXU Yes, we did receive an amount of money which we were told was to help us with funeral expenses. ADV SANDI Where did it come from? MR RWEXU We were told that it was the State President's fund. ADV SANDI How much was it? MR RWEXU It was R16 000-00. ADV SANDI By your presence here today Mr Rwexu, do you have any wish which you would like to express or any request which you would like to make? MR RWEXU My mother's children and also the children there at home, are left in my care and I would like to ask that they be assisted with their education because this has all effected us. When there is any - when you are a family, you dream together and things like that, and when you have a mother in your home, you know that even when something bothers you outside, you can come home and talk to your mother and life is priceless, you cannot bring back the life of that person, but I would ask that these children be assisted in their education. ADV SANDI You come across as being very strong even though you are talking about something as gruesome as the death of these three persons when they were burnt to death on the same day, including your mother. Is there - can you just tell us where you draw your strength from, because you seem exceptionally strong? MR RWEXU I am not really as strong as I seem. I suffer from severe depression due to this incident. ADV SANDI Where do these children live now that you referred to? MR RWEXU We all live together at home after I had fixed up the place. ADV SANDI Where is Duzana? MR RWEXU Duzana is in Port Elizabeth. ADV SANDI Is that all you would like to say Mr Rwexu? MR RWEXU There is nothing else I would like to say beyond that, Mr Chairperson. ADV SANDI Thank you very much, Mr Rwexu. Let us now go to Mrs Siko. According to your statement Mrs Siko, your statement was from Nomakhwezi Georgina Siko, is that your daughter? MRS SIKO Yes. ADV SANDI Who is going to give testimony, is it going to be you or your daughter? MRS SIKO I will be the one who will be testifying, but because I was not there, she will help me? ADV SANDI Is that correct, Ma'am? MS SIKO Yes, that is correct. ADV SANDI You are going to talk about what happened to you Nomakhwezi and you are also going to tell us about Nontozake? MS SIKO No, Ndumasi. Ndumasi Siko. ADV SANDI Please continue, Nomakhwezi. MS SIKO I will talk about Ndumasi first. In 1985, on the 27th of December Ndumasi Siko, my brother was burnt in the stadium. My mother was not there at the time, when people came to tell us, she was at work. The police went to her work to tell her about this. She was then informed that Ndumasi was burnt down at the stadium. ADV SANDI How old was Ndumasi at that time? MS SIKO He was 14 years old and he was doing standard 3. My mother was told that Ndumasi was burnt in the stadium. She could not go to see him, my father went there to see him. He found out that there was blood in the stadium, on the steps of the stadium. We do not know whether he was stabbed or not. He was also gagged. The people who did this to him, they ran away. ADV SANDI Were they arrested for this incident? MS SIKO No, they were not arrested, but only one of them was arrested, it Mncedisi Mgxotheni. Others, they ran away. The case was conducted in 1988, but it did not continue any further. ADV SANDI Why were they killing Ndumasi? What reasons did they give? MS SIKO It was said that they were looking for me, they asked Ndumasi where I was, but Ndumasi did not tell them. ADV SANDI Why were they looking for you? MS SIKO I don't know whether they wanted to kill me, because they had burnt me before. ADV SANDI Were you also burnt before? MS SIKO Yes, in 1985. ADV SANDI Please tell us about your incident? MS SIKO In 1985, Municipality police station was being burnt in the township, there was tension and chaos in the township. My sister Nontozake was employed as a cleaner in this new police station. I was supposed to bring her lunch that day. I was also looking for work in that company as I was not employed at that time. At about three, I decided to go home because the people would come back from work. I went through the bush, I saw people. I went through the open field, when I was about to reach home, there were people coming towards me and they beat me, they were using all sorts of weapons to beat me. ADV SANDI Did you notice any of the people who were beating you? MS SIKO Those were people who were staying in the same street. Those were people whom I grew up with. I went home and they followed me, they kicked the door. I then opened the door for them, because I thought that they were going to talk with me. They then beat me in the head and they dragged me out of the gate, they were assaulting me all the time. They took me in a corner and then they beat me there. We were in one house, they went to one house, 161 C, to take paraffin. They then put a tyre and put this paraffin in this tyre, they were beating me all the time. I couldn't bear the pain, I took out the tyre because it was burning at that time. They beat me, I managed to take the tyre out of my neck. They then - I then fell on top of this tyre. All this time they were beating me. I was confused, I couldn't see anything at that time, it was dark. I then heard a gunshot, but it was far away. When they heard this gunshot, they ran away. I then staggered, I managed to go home. My sister took me and she tried to wash me. We locked the doors. While we were still at home, the one who was a cleaner, she then came back home, these people were chasing her. ADV SANDI ; Are you referring to Nontozake? MS SIKO Yes, she ran and she opened the door quickly, she then locked the door. My mother came back from work at about six, she then took me to hospital, Settlers Hospital. I was operated in Settlers Hospital. I was then given medicine and I was bandaged. ADV SANDI You said that in your arm? MS SIKO Yes, my arm was cracked, my head was also cracked. ADV SANDI You suffer from continuous headaches? MS SIKO Yes. ADV SANDI How were you injured? MS SIKO In my left leg and in my body. ADV SANDI Were you still at school at that time? MS SIKO Yes, I was still at school. ADV SANDI Did you go back to school? MS SIKO No, I didn't manage to go back to school, because I was scared. I couldn't even stay here in Grahamstown. ADV SANDI What standard were you? MS SIKO I was doing standard 5 at that time. ADV SANDI In your statement you said that the people who attacked you, they said that you were dirty? MS SIKO Yes. ADV SANDI Because you were sending lunch to your sister, Nontozake? MS SIKO Yes. ADV SANDI Did they give you any other reason for saying that you were dirty except for the reason they have given you? MS SIKO No, they just said that I was dirty, that is why they burnt me. ADV SANDI What happened to Nontozake? MS SIKO Nothing happened to her, they didn't manage to get her. ADV SANDI Are you receiving treatment now because of this incident? MS SIKO No. ADV SANDI Is there a need for you to get treatment? MS SIKO Yes, there is a need because of these headaches. ADV SANDI These continuous headaches? MS SIKO Yes. ADV SANDI Do you want to add something Ma'am, to what Nomakhwezi has already said? MRS SIKO No, there is nothing. ADV SANDI Let us now ask this question. By coming here to the Commission, what are your expectations or what do you wish the Commission to do for you? MRS SIKO Yes, I do have a wish. The people who killed Ndumasi, were not arrested. Ndumasi was playing outside, one girl came to take him at home, there was a shot next to the stadium. This girl said Ndumasi let us go to the shop, I will buy you sweets. This group was waiting for him in the shop. ADV SANDI Was it during the day? MRS SIKO It was after five. ADV SANDI Did Ndumasi belong to any political organisation at the time of this incident? MRS SIKO No, he was still young at the time. He had two friends. ADV SANDI Is that all you wanted to say? Do you want to add something to what has already been said? MRS SIKO I would like the people who killed Ndumasi, to be arrested. The girl who came to fetch Ndumasi would be called now and again. ADV SANDI Are they still in Grahamstown? MRS SIKO No. ADV SANDI Do you know their names? We would like you to go to our administration table to give out these names. Is that all you wanted to say? Do you have any more requests, except that you wanted this case to be reopened? MS SIKO There was one man, Mahodi, who was not arrested in my case. He was the one who tied me in my legs with wires. ADV SANDI Is he still around Grahamstown? MS SIKO Yes, he is here in Grahamstown. ADV SANDI Thank you Ma'am. Let us now go to Mrs Sandi. Could I call you Mrs Sandi, even though you swore yourself in as Mrs Sukula? MRS SANDI Yes, you may. ADV SANDI We are going to talk about something that happened at your place in 1986, where a house was set alight and a child, girl by the name Nontyatyambo, was attacked. I would like you to start explaining to us what happened, which led to the setting alight of Nontyatyambo? MRS SANDI On the day all this happened, was on the 27th of August. It was on a Monday after 7 pm, when these children came, knocked at my house and this one child turned up there and said that they were looking for Nontyatyambo. Nontyatyambo was sleeping in the one room in the house. I asked, because I could see that there were many of them, I asked them what they wanted with her and they said that they had come to her, she then got up and came to us and they then said to her, we've come to you, you know what you have done. She said, what have I done? There were approximately six children inside the house already and others were outside. Those that were inside were looking for a phone, so that they could cut the lines, they said Nontyatyambo, you know what you have done, and she said I don't know anything. They said, and then I wanted to know from them, what is it, what has she done and they said no, she knows. And they said, come, let's go to the other comrades. We then, they took her outside and I wanted to follow them, wanting to know where they were taking her. They said no, we are going to the corner. They then took her out. The one child Lezugo and another Mfulani child. When we got to the corner they took myself, Nontyatyambo Zolizwa and this other child that stayed with us, when we got to the corner house, number 17 M Street, I asked them which corner is this? They said no Ma'am, we are going to this place up ahead. When we got to the corner of L Street, they said no, we are passing here and we are going to this other corner. We went to K Street. ADV SANDI Excuse me, were they dragging her? MS SANDI They were holding us all. Not dragging us, but they were holding us and we got to K Street and they said here are the comrades, and I said where are these big comrades? They said, what we want from you is you are going to tell us where our firearms are which you took and went to give to the Mungundwana, the Rats, the municipal police. She said, I don't know what you are talking about, they said we saw you get into a casper, belonging to the Defence Force and we want our firearms, four of our firearms were taken by the police. By this time they were dragging her. And she said I don't know about anything and I wanted to know what firearms are these. Why can't you just talk about this? And she was clinging onto me and they dragged her with force from me and there was a biggish tree. We struggled for her and they eventually got her and they said we are going to show you, we want these firearms. They dragged her and dropped her to the ground. When she fell to the ground, some of them were kicking her and I tried to protect her and wanted to know what firearms they were talking about. And I got her again and she clung to me and they said to her, you are stubborn. I went to her and picked her up again and I was trying to move away. These - my other children were starting to run away and I called them to come and help me. I grabbed her and they grabbed her once again and dropped her to the ground for a third time. I picked her up again, but this time, I don't know what it was, some of them were assaulting me on my head and my back and dragging me away from her. And in this time I could see a tyre. When she fell, they put her near the tyre and they pulled me away and said that I should go home and telling me that they were going to deal with my daughter. A group of them pushed me away, when we got to M Street, there were so many of them who said to me, you know where you stay, go home. When we got near number 17, I said oh, my God, my child, I don't know what they are going to do to this child. And by this time they were throwing things at me and I started running. ADV SANDI Where was Wallace in all this time when you were being chased home? MRS SANDI I cannot say where he was, because there were so many children who were pushing me when I was going home, but the one who I saw was Zolizwa who was also running because they were throwing obstacles at her as well. We ran when I went to number 7 to look for comrade Nzuzu to please help me because I did not know what they were doing to my child. When I came back, I found Ntomtetilele who was her husband and he she was not there. When I got close to my house, Zolizwa was there and Wallace was standing there and when I was going to go into the house, Nontyatyambo was approaching and she was naked by this time. When she got close to me I held onto her and she had been severely burnt down her front to her stomach. I took her and took a towel which was close by and covered her. I went with her to number 17 to try and get a telephone. There they did not want to have anything to do with me, saying that I was going to cause trouble for them. I then went to the Qangile home in M Street and I said, when I got there there were policemen at the gate and she was talking throughout giving the names of these children, Mfulani child and names of Lizwa and those others and the ambulance was called and it took us to the hospital. When we got to the hospital, they treated her and we were told that we were going to be taken to Port Elizabeth and she was treated there and then we were told, shown the ward where she was going to be admitted. I think we must have got back at quarter to four. I then left her, I told her that I would be back. I got home, promising her that I would come and see her the Tuesday. When I got home, I was preparing for work, I was working at St Andrew's. I prepared for work. When I got to my work, I informed by employer about what happened. We phoned her father there and then. Her father was working in Port Elizabeth at a packaging company. We got hold of him at Bod Packaging and I told him what happened at home. He said there and then that he would go and see her. That was the Tuesday. My employer said to me that she would keep phoning to find out how she was. ADV SANDI And eventually you received a telephone call at work saying that she did not survive the injuries which she sustained? MRS SANDI On the Wednesday when I was preparing at work for my employer to take me to Port Elizabeth, I received a telephone call and informed that my child had passed away. This is while I was preparing to go and see her in Port Elizabeth. ADV SANDI Was anyone arrested in connection with this incident? MRS SANDI Yes, there were people who were arrested because she herself had said who they were. ADV SANDI ; Were these people convicted? MRS SANDI They were convicted but they were sentenced to some corporal punishment and that was all. ADV SANDI Were you able to conduct the funeral without any incidents or interference? MRS SANDI My brother was Sergeant Sukula, took me because they had already burnt down the house, my house the Thursday after having burnt my child the Wednesday and then my brother took me to his house, at number 197. ADV SANDI Did you ever receive an opportunity thereafter to go back to your house? MRS SANDI I could never go back to my house because there was a Mr Nango who was still living there up to this day, he said he was speaking to his older brother about renting the place. What happened was that I was living at my work and Mr Nango never came to me. What his brother said was that this man was going to rent the house, but they never came back to me. Thereafter, after some time I heard that my child's father had given the house to him. ADV SANDI Whose house did you say it was in your statement? MRS SANDI ; It is my brother's house. After this incident, my children and I went to go and stay at my brother's place. Thereafter in - on the 6th of January of the following year, my sister-in-law indicated that she wanted this house back, which my brother had said we could stay in. I then gave the house back and I am renting a house from my aunt in Nyameni and my niece is paying the rent for me since she is employed and I don't have a place of my own, to this day. ADV SANDI Is there anything else you would like to say before I ask you what your expectations and wishes are from this Commission? MRS SANDI That is basically all I have to say with regard to the incident for now. I never used to wear spectacles back then, but because of the injuries I sustained, my head, I don't know what happened, but I started wearing spectacles thereafter. The Doctor said that there was also something wrong with my blood and I still suffer constant headaches to this day. And I am now due to go and have my spectacles changed again, but I cannot afford to because I am unemployed. ADV SANDI Thank you very much Mrs Sandi. If there is anything which you still have to say, we will have the Committee direct questions to you. Mrs Madinda, in your statement you said that your house was burnt down. Was it in 31 O Street? MRS MADINDA Yes, that is correct Mr Chairman. ADV SANDI Please tell us what happened in 31 O Street when your house was burnt down? MRS MADINDA It was at night, on a Sunday night. I was sleeping in one room and my daughter was in another room. I was sleeping together with someone who used to come and sleep in the room. I heard someone say that the house was on fire. I woke up and I saw flames all over. They were coming through the windows. I was surprised. We tried to look for a key as we were sleeping, the door was locked. I took this child who was sleeping with me, I took him out through the window and I also took my daughter. I followed them, we ran in the backyard, there were tenants in this yard. They were also surprised, they woke up, they then went out. There was also Mr Mpati who was a tenant, he went back home. He tried to take out the furniture. He then got injured because he sustained, he was burnt. In the morning we tried to borrow clothes so that we can go and report it to the police. The police told us that they cannot help us because they were not responsible for what was happening in the township. The casper then came in the township. There were two White men who came out. They then said that they cannot do anything. That is all. ADV SANDI Was it in 1986? MRS MADINDA Yes, it was in June 1986. ADV SANDI Mr Timoti Mbuyisela Pota Mlonyeni, was he also a tenant? MRS MADINDA Yes, he was also one of the tenants. ADV SANDI Did he stay in the backyard? MRS MADINDA Yes, he stayed in the back room. ADV SANDI His furniture was it also burnt? MRS MADINDA Everything was burnt because we tried to save our lives. We did not take our furniture. ADV SANDI Were there any rumours concerning who burnt down your house? MRS MADINDA Up until today I did not hear anything. ADV SANDI What about Mr Mlonyeni, did he suspect anyone? MRS MADINDA I don't know about him, because I did not talk to him, I thought he would be here today, because after that, we parted. ADV SANDI Before your house was burnt down, were there any events that happened that show that your house would be burnt down? MRS MADINDA I did not notice anything before except that I was selling things to people as I was earning not enough, this children would, there would be children who would come to me telling me that we were not supposed to sell anything because of boycotts and I would listen to them. ADV SANDI Did you have any conflicts with anyone or did you receive any threats that your house would be burnt? MRS MADINDA No. ADV SANDI Do you have a request to the Commission? MRS MADINDA My request is that I would like to know who burnt down this house. ADV SANDI Was there anyone arrested? MRS MADINDA No, there was no one arrested. ADV SANDI Is that all Mrs Madinda? MRS MADINDA Yes, that is all. ADV SANDI Thank you Mrs Madinda, thank you Mr Chairperson. CHAIRMAN Nomakhwezi Siko, you mentioned Ndumasi in your testimony, Ndumasi Siko. What happened to him? MS SIKO He was necklaced. CHAIRMAN In the statement before us you did not mention his case? MS SIKO Yes. CHAIRMAN Would you like to submit a statement concerning this incident? MS SIKO At the time I was, I only submitted my incident, I did not say anything about Ndumasi. CHAIRMAN You have to make a statement about his incident, because what we have here is about yourself. We will have a problem if we don't get Ndumasi's statement. Thank you. I would like to thank the four of you, Mr Rwexu, Nomakhwezi Siko, Mrs Sandi and Tenjiwe Madinda. These are very painful incidents. I was saying that these incidents are very painful. Starting with Mr Rwexu, it surprises us that you lost all your family, they have been burnt because there was someone who was working for the police. You were only compensated, you only got R16 000-00. Your house was burnt and three people were also killed who were inside. This shows that the Government of the day did not care because the police, whether we like it or not, were working for that Government. The people did not like the police, the people were not fighting for the individual police, but they were fighting because the police were working for that Government. Some of the police lost their lives because they were protecting that Government, past Government. It is surprising to us that when such a person lost three of his family members and the house was also burnt, the Government only gave him R16 000-00. We are glad to hear this as the Commission, it confirms what we have already heard of incidents such as this. In our minds as the people who were fighting against the Government of that day, we thought that such people get millions of rands. We are surprised today to find out that this Government did not care for the people who were working under him. The Government was using this people but when they were in trouble because of working for him, as the police, the Government wouldn't care. We would like to sympathise with you about what happened to you, about the scandal that happened to you. Nomakhwezi Siko has told us a terrible story, a painful story. She managed to escape death. We are glad that she is here today because as she was telling her story, she was supposed to be dead today together with Mrs Sandi by telling us about her daughter Nontyatyambo, who was also necklaced. Tenjiwe Madinda, telling us about her house which was burnt by people who were unknown. These incidents are one of those incidents that were painful in the struggle of liberation. That the people who were fighting for the liberation, used such painful methods, they were burning people who were alleged to be informers, and who were alleged to be working with the police. We thank you for giving us this picture, it is a clear picture and it will remain in our minds. People who are here today, who are listening to this story so that when we look back in our struggle, we also learn from the mistakes of the struggle. We have seen the mistakes that have happened in that struggle, we thank you for coming here because we did not want to listen to what the police have said but who have done to the people, such stories are part of our history. We have noted your requests. We are going to forward them to the President of this country who will decide what to do about your requests. For now, you may go back to your seats, thank you.