hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATION HEARINGS 1996-04-22 HEIDERVELD 1 CT/00702 ISAAC NDAZEMSELA RANI ISAAC NDAZEMSELA RANI TORTURE https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55184&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/heide/ct00702.htm DR BORAINE Can you hear my voice coming through with the translation - okay Mr Rani are you willing to take the oath. ISAAC NDAZEMSELA RANI Duly sworn states DR BORAINE Thank you very much indeed, will you be seated please. Mr Rani the first thing we want to say to you is that we are extremely grateful to you for coming along today. The story that you will tell the Commission goes back a very-very long time until 1962. And you have had this story in your heart and mind and we hope you will feel comfortable and relaxed in sharing it with us. In order to assist you, Commissioner Yasmin Sooka will help you in leading your evidence. Thank you very much indeed for coming. MS SOOKA MR RANI MS SOOKA Ja, are you married? MR RANI Yes I was married. MS SOOKA [Question inaudible] MR RANI MS SOOKA Mr Rani at the time when you left this country were you a member of a political party? MR RANI Most definitely. MS SOOKA Which party were you a member of? MR RANI African National Congress. MS SOOKA I see how old were you when you left the country? MR RANI Well when I left it was 1961. MS SOOKA Do you want to tell us why you left? MR RANI It is because I went for training. MS SOOKA Where did you go to? MR RANI When I left I met Mr Alfred Ngudle, he sent me to Johannesburg. Then from Johannesburg then I went to Tanzania, then from there I went to [indistinct] MS SOOKA You were arrested in what was then the old Rhodesia in 1962. Do you want to tell us a little bit about that? MR RANI MS SOOKA Mr Rani, could you tell me who the men were who picked you up at Bulowayo, the men who brought you to Messina. Were they members of the Security Police? MR RANI They were Rhodesian police at Bulowayo, Mr Smith, it was Mr Smith. MS SOOKA And then handed you over to the Security Police in Messina? MR RANI They handed me over to the police here in South Africa, and those are the people now who took me to Pretoria. MS SOOKA When you were taken to Pretoria, who were the other eight people who were with you? MR RANI The people who were with me, that I can remember it was: Wilfred Alfred Khonza Malgas Jantjies, Alfred Jantjies. MS SOOKA [Question inaudible] MR RANI Some of them I have forgot them, but I am still trying to remember. MS SOOKA MR RANI MS SOOKA What else did they do to you in the prison and do you know how did this - do you remember the names of the people who tortured you? MR RANI The people who tortured me, they were torturing me in a police station in Greyvenstein, those people were Fred van Niekerk, he was the boss of everybody else at that time. Smith - Smith and everybody else were also under Van Niekerk, because he was the boss. MS SOOKA Did he beat you. MR RANI Too much - very hard. He beat me very hard. MS SOOKA Was it the beating that made you vomit? MR RANI That is exactly what made me to vomit blood, it is the beating, even now my arms are still numb, they even have cracks from both arms. MS SOOKA You mentioned where [indistinct] earlier that they brought a doctor to see you, do you remember the name of the doctor? MR RANI MS SOOKA Was this after you vomited blood? MR RANI No this happened before I vomited blood. MS SOOKA I see, what did they to you before you vomited the blood beside the beatings, what did they do to you? MR RANI MS SOOKA I see, was the doctor nice to you - did he examine you properly? MR RANI I commend him because even now I am - I can say I am cured. Even when I went to Court, when I had to appear in Court, luckily because we were kidnapped from Rhodesia, nobody knew where we were. When we got to Pretoria we were split up and then luckily one of the prisoners came, he told me not to close the window, the one behind me. Nobody was allowed to talk to me, and he threw a small piece of paper through the window. And now he was trying to find out what have I done to - for me to be here. So I also wrote a little note, I also threw it through the window, when it - when it got to him outside, I said to him he must give it to the police outside - he must - I wanted to tell him that I want to get out of here. Okay the lawyer took my statement, okay we were given, the verdict was passed, but now Titus knew and his wife that - that he simply left. INTERPRETER I am sorry the witness says sentences are not completely finished sometimes. MS SOOKA MR RANI MS SOOKA The Attorney General. MR RANI The prosecution went on and then after that okay everything just - disbanded. MS SOOKA How long were you kept in the prison before you were brought to the proceedings in the Court, before you were put on trial, how long did they keep you? MR RANI They kept me for a long time - a long-long time. MS SOOKA Do you remember the date at all? MR RANI MS SOOKA The year [inaudible] MR RANI 1962. MS SOOKA You were sentenced to two years imprisonment, is that? MR RANI MS SOOKA You were told to report at the police station - how did you feel about that? MR RANI MS SOOKA [Inaudible] how many children have you got? MR RANI They were ten at the beginning. But three passed away. MS SOOKA How did you support yourself then Mr Rani? MR RANI I tried their mother and themselves, I use to go and fish and I would even get some work from the contractors for a while, just for my kids to have something to eat. But there was nothing else I could do. MS SOOKA I want to take you back a little bit to what you told me before, you said that you were told to report to the police station every morning, but were you - where you kept under house arrest at all when you came back to Cape Town? MR RANI MS SOOKA MR RANI MS SOOKA Did they harass you for a long time? MR RANI Yes they did, they did harass me. Then eventually I got a job at Cavana, it was known then as Cavana at Salt River. I worked there for a while on my fourth week working there, they took me from that work - from my work place to Johannesburg. Only to find out there is another case that I have to be taken to there. When I got there I was arrested. They got hand grenades and all other firearms. They were told that they were from abroad, they were send to me. When I got there I was surprised to find that these were mine. And I was asking them okay why are these with you instead of with me if they are mine, and they told me there is a box with your name on it. MS SOOKA Who arrested you the second time, was it the same person who arrested you the first time? MR RANI MS SOOKA Where did they take you to? MR RANI They took me to Johannesburg in the Central Prison. From there they took me to East London. And they took me to East London until the date of the trial, I stayed there, I stayed there until I had to come to - to appear to Court. When I did, they were accusing me of all these grenades. The grenades that I was using, they were from Cuba and Russia ja. Those are - those are the ones I was using. These are the Bazookas I have no idea of - of them. I told the Judge but you people are framing me because I - you even made a mistake, you people have no rest. MS SOOKA What did the Judge [indistinct] you. MR RANI MS SOOKA Do you remember the name of the Judge who heard your case? MR RANI I think it was Justice Roedolf. MS SOOKA Could you tell me how long it was after - do you remember the date when you were taken to East London for this? MR RANI It was Mondee not East London, I went to Mondee. Now I do not know the date, I mean we uneducated people we have no idea of these dates. MS SOOKA What happened after [indistinct] MR RANI MS SOOKA MR RANI MS SOOKA Mr Rani could I take you back a little bit, I just want to ask you a little more questions about the time when you were kidnapped in Rhodesia. Could you tell me where you were when you were kidnapped and where you were taken to by the Rhodesian police please. MR RANI MS SOOKA When - what were you doing in Bulowayo when the Rhodesian police picked you up? MR RANI MS SOOKA Who was with you, you talked about we and you said to me that Alfred and Malgas and Alfred Jantjies were with you. Do you remember the other people who were with you? MR RANI MS SOOKA MR RANI MS SOOKA But do you know what happened to them? MR RANI They were sentenced. Some escaped before I did, they were running away from the State of Emergency, they went to Lesotho, and now when they - when they were discovered they were told you were - you ran away at a certain time. MS SOOKA Could you tell me what you do now? How do you support yourself now? MR RANI MS SOOKA MR RANI MS SOOKA Are you happy to share that information? MR RANI I am very happy. I am very happy so that everybody else can know what happened. MS SOOKA What - what do you actually feel the Commission should you, what would make you feel better? MR RANI MS SOOKA Thank you very much for telling us your story. CHAIRPERSON Thank you, any questions - yes. DR BORAINE Mr Rani I need your help, you told us that after you were tortured you were visited by the doctor, the District Surgeon, who examined out. Was that right - okay. MR RANI Exactly. DR BORAINE Can you remember what he said to you? MR RANI The only problem is the beating up, because no-one else can do anything for me, no-one can do anything really for me. The only person, the only thing that can happen is for me to stay with me in prison. DR BORAINE Let met try to find out what you mean, are you saying that if the doctor helped you, he would also go to jail? MR RANI Yes he was going to be arrested because look my lawyer was also arrested. He was really also going to be arrested. DR BORAINE That - thank you that helps me. In other words even the doctors who should be helping were nervous to help people like you. MR RANI They were very scarred, very-very scarred. They were really scared. DR BORAINE Thank you very much for your help. CHAIRPERSON Yes. MS SOOKA Mr Rani just a few more questions, were you tortured at the Pretoria Central or were you - at the prison or were you tortured at the police station, can you remember? MR RANI MS SOOKA And just another question, were you kidnapped first and you were then taken and arrested, do you remember - do you remember what happened first. Were you first taken to the police station or did they kidnap you first, can you remember that part when you were kidnapped in Rhodesia. MR RANI MS SOOKA Do you know if the others were tortured as well? MR RANI MS SOOKA Were you - when you were charged in Court, when you were triad, were you trialed for leaving the country without having a passport, or were you trialed for having undergone military training, can you remember that? MR RANI MS SOOKA And when you were brought to trial? MR RANI At the Court is - because I was charged for leaving the country. MS SOOKA Can you also tell me do you recall ever being taken to a hospital after you were tortured? MR RANI No, I was never taken to hospital, I was treated in the cell. MS SOOKA Thank you. MR POTGIETER Mr Rani just one issue, the policeman whom you refer to as Fred van Niekerk, where was he from? MR RANI I know Fred van Niekerk when he was still in Cape Town at Phillipi, he was still here, Phillipi at Cape Town. He was transferred to Pretoria where he is at the moment. ADV POTGIETER And what - what rank did he have, what did they call him, did they call him Sergeant or a General or what, what did they call him? MR RANI They called him Major. ADV POTGIETER Major [indistinct] MR RANI Yes. ADV POTGIETER Thank you - thank you Chairperson. MS SOOKA Mr Rani can I say that I am really struck by the way you have talked today. You have such spirit and I am amazed by the fact that you can still laugh about your experiences. MR RANI MS BURTON Mr Rani the colleagues of yours who were kidnapped and then arrested with you, did you never see any of them again? MR RANI CHAIRPERSON I would also like to say that we thank you, we also thank the way that even the people who tried to destroy you, but now today you can be able to see this freedom, the freedom that you struggled for. Thank you.