hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS, SUBMISSIONS QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 1997-06-11 EAST LONDON 3 MANDLA TOBEZWENI EC408/96 MDANTSANE https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55265&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/hrvel2/tobezwen.htm CHAIRPERSON We would like to call Mandla Tobezweni to come forward. Mandla Tobezweni, we welcome you. We would like Reverend Xundu to help you take an oath. MANDLA TOBEZWENI (Duly sworn in, states). REV XUNDU Thank you Mr Chairperson, he has been properly sworn in. CHAIRPERSON Tiny Maya. MS MAYA Thank you Mr Chairperson. Mr Tobezweni, your story before the Commission today concerns yourself. You were arrested and tortured in Ciskei, especially 1987. Is that correct? MR TOBEZWENI Yes, that is correct. MS MAYA I will now give you time to tell us your story, briefly. MR TOBEZWENI Thank you. On the 20th of July 1987 at about half past two, I was at work at that time. I was called to the office. I thought that they called me, because I had a telephone call. When I got to the office there were White men from CBA and Cambridge. They called me inside. They told me to go with them to Cambridge. I said to them that I left my jacket in the locker. They told me to go with them as I was. We went at about three and there was another worker who was taken with that car. When we were near the John Vorster Bridge, one White man said that I had a link with a banned organisation. I did not answer that. We got to Cambridge. There was an album in Cambridge. He paged through this album looking for a particular person, but he did not find the photograph of this person. He then took me to a Ford Sierra. He told me to put my duster coat in my face. When we passed Highgate I peeped through, because I wanted to know where they were taking me to. They were talking with each other at the time. What I forgot is that when they did not the photograph in that album they said that I am going to tell them the truth in Mdantsane. When we got to Mdantsane they were angry and they dragged me and they were pushing me towards the burglar proofs in Cambridge. MS MAYA Before you can go forward, Mr Tobezweni, I have a request. Unfortunately, the statement before us shows us that the names of the police who tortured you are not here and that means that you cannot mention these names here. We only heard about their names on Sunday when we were talking to you. I would like you not to mention their names, because they are not in your statement. You may proceed. MR TOBEZWENI They put, they took me to the office in Mdantsane and when I got there, there were about 16 Security Branch officers. They told me to sit down. I sat down. They asked me about Sipho Dlomo. I said I do not know him. They said that I was going to tell them the truth. They put me in a table and they hand-cuffed my legs. They also hand-cuffed my, they tied my hands behind, putting a plastic in my face asking whether I knew Sipho Dlomo. MS MAYA Where did they put the plastic? MR TOBEZWENI They put the plastic in my face. I said that I did not know Sipho Dlomo. They asked me about Mathemba Vuso. I said, yes, I knew Mathemba Vuso, we use to play soccer together. They asked me where he was. I said I do not know. They said that you are going to tell us the truth. They put a plastic again saying that what I was saying, they were going to write it down. They put a tube in my face for a long time. My hands were tied behind and I was also hand-cuffed in my legs. The tube was still in my face. I lost strength. MS MAYA For how long did they do this to you? MR TOBEZWENI We got there at half past three in the police station. They did this up until half past five. MS MAYA After this did they release you or were you arrested? MR TOBEZWENI I was taken by the police, they took me to NU12. In NU12 they put me in cell number eight. It was dark at that time. The police who was there showed me blankets, toilet and water. I was feeling pain at that time. After that the police locked me inside and left me there. I was feeling pain in that cell and the next morning at about eight they came and look at me. I was still there. The following day, on the 22nd, I was arrested on the 20th and on the 22nd of July they came again. They called me as GCN24 and they called my name out. On the way one police asked me whether I went, I knew Port Elizabeth. I said that, yes, I use to go to Port Elizabeth. He asked me whether I knew Buing. I said, no, I do not know that. Can I mention their names? MS MAYA No, do not mention them Mr Tobezweni. Thank you. MR TOBEZWENI They then took two tables, they took a plank about a metre long. They placed this plank in my arms and between my legs and my arms. They tied it, asked where Mathemba was. I said I do not know. MS MAYA Let us go back, we will come back to this issue. Why were they arresting you? Did you have any connection with political organisation in the township or what was happening? MR TOBEZWENI I did not have any connections with political activities. MS MAYA The people who were asked from you, where, who are they? MR TOBEZWENI Mathemba Vuso was playing soccer with me. He left in 1982, left for Johannesburg to look for work. MS MAYA After he left to Johannesburg was there any connection between the two of you? MR TOBEZWENI No. MS MAYA The people who were in exile, who came back were you in connection with them? MR TOBEZWENI He just came back saying that he was from Johannesburg. He came together with his friend. He introduced me to the friend, they left again. MS MAYA You were not aware that they were coming from exile? MR TOBEZWENI No, I was not aware. MS MAYA Thank you. Please continue. MR TOBEZWENI They tortured me, assaulting me, asking me about his friend, Mathemba. They asked me where he was staying. I said I do not know. They put plastics in my face and they put a tube in my face from ten o' clock to two o' clock. MS MAYA This torture, when did it stop? MR TOBEZWENI I was released on the 20th of October. MS MAYA All this time you were being tortured in this way? MR TOBEZWENI I was tortured on Monday and on a Wednesday. Especially on a Wednesday. MS MAYA Why did they, what happened, why did they stop torturing you? MR TOBEZWENI They stopped torturing me when one man came. This man was also arrested. MS MAYA You said that the name was, the man was Sindi Dlangula? MR TOBEZWENI Yes. I pretended to be dead, because they put a plastic in my face. As a result of that I could not breathe. After putting off the plastic they would put on a tube in my face. I pretended to be dead, because I could not breathe. They were scared at that time. They tried to beat me in my thighs with a sjambok and I could not move. They then took a cigarette, they burnt me with the cigarette and they used seven cigarettes. They wanted me to wake up and I was relaxed at the time, because they put off the tube in my face. MS MAYA When Sindi Dlangula got in they stopped torturing you? MR TOBEZWENI I urinated myself and I was trying to look around to these people who were torturing me. While I was still trying to wake up they kicked me again and I could not breathe again, but I managed to get up and I sat in the chair and Sipho got in. MS MAYA You said that you were released in October. What happened? MR TOBEZWENI I saw the police coming in October telling me I was released. MS MAYA Did you appear in a Court of Law? MR TOBEZWENI No. MS MAYA As you were tortured in this way and you got injured, did you lay a charge or did you go to any attorneys for advice? MR TOBEZWENI I did not lay a charge and all the time I was wearing one trouser and one shirt and a duster coat and there was blood in the duster coat from my, both arms. I reported to the police that I was bleeding. They said that they are going to send someone. A Chief Magistrate came and I reported this matter to the Chief Magistrate saying that I was, I had a problem with my arm. He wrote this down and he told me that people from NU1 are recovering. MS MAYA What is the Magistrate's name? MR TOBEZWENI It is Mr Nwaba. MS MAYA Thank you. Is that all your story Sir? If you would like to add something you may do so. MR TOBEZWENI On the fifth these police came to check me. They, my two arms were swollen and these police, that I am not going to mention by names, went to NU12 clinic. The nurse who was there asked me where I was coming from. I said that I was coming from detention. This nurse said that she cannot treat me, because there was one nurse who was in court because she treated a detainee. They took me back to the cell. The following day, on the sixth, they took me to Cecilia Makiwane Hospital. In Cecilia Makiwane Hospital they then took me to Dr Mklenge. My arm was swollen and people asked me what happened. I said that I was involved in a car accident. Dr Mklenge asked me what happened. I said that I was tortured on the 20th and on the 22nd. I stayed for 15 days and they took me to hospital on the 16th day. Dr Mklenge gave me medicine and told me to go hospital frequently so that I can be checked. The two police said that I was going to treat myself in the cell. My, both arms were swollen. It was difficult to use the tap in the cell. When I tried to change I would have, I would wash my trouser and I would be naked, because I would have to wait for it to dry up. My wife tried to bring clothes for me, but she was not allowed to get in. MS MAYA Thank you Mr Tobezweni. After you were released did you lay a charge? MR TOBEZWENI No, I did not, because these people were police and I would have to lay a charge in other police. MS MAYA What is your request to the Commission? MR TOBEZWENI I had twins born in 1985. They were homeless at that time and I am still feeling pain in my back as a result of this torture. I would like a medical aid, because the one I had was dissolved. I have three children and the younger child is three years old. I went to stay in East London in Breylon. My children are studying in Southernwood. I have to pay R400,00 school fees for them. MS MAYA What is your request concerning your children? MR TOBEZWENI They are using bus to school. It is R40,50. I take them to school and they come back with the bus. I do not, I was operated three times in my back. I was broken while I was playing rugby and I had screws in my body, seven screws and. MS MAYA Where were these screws? MR TOBEZWENI They were in my ankle. So I would like the Commission to help me, but I am scared of getting another operation. Maybe I will be paralysed. MS MAYA Thank you Mr Tobezweni. My last question. The people who tortured you in this way, if you can see them today what would you say to them? Do you have peace in your heart? MR TOBEZWENI I would have peace if they can come forward. My children are asking me what happened to my arms. I said that I was assaulted by the police. If these police can come forward and my children can be here I would show my children that these are the people who assaulted me and that would satisfy me. MS MAYA Thank you Mr Tobezweni. I will hand over to the Chairperson. Maybe you will be asked questions. CHAIRPERSON Mr Tobezweni, thank you for coming before the Commission. When you were making your written statement you, did you mention the people who tortured you, because the Law of the Commission states that if one is going to mention the name of the perpetrator in public, that perpetrator has to be noticed, the perpetrator has to be notified 21 days before the hearing so that he can get a chance to come forward if he wants to, but unfortunately you did not give out those details in your statement, but although you did not mention them in public, we would like you to go to that table and to give out these names so that we can include these names in your statement. I thank you for coming before the Commission and we thank you for your story. You may go back to your seat Mr Tobezweni.