hrvtrans STATEMENT BY THWANE ROTHO 1996-10-07 KAROO 1 https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55367&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/karoo/rotho.htm MS BURTON Our investigating team have been following up and getting the evidence that we need in order that we be able to make a finding and they have taken a statement from an eye witness in this incident. He is a person who is presently in prison, but the prison authorities have given permission for him to come and to give additional evidence. So I am now going to call him to come to the stage. I am just making sure that he is available and we can find him. Can we have Mr Thwane Rotho to the stage. Mr Rotho you are very welcome - thank you very much for being willing to make a statement and to come here today. Can you hear me all right on the ear phones? THWANE ROTHO Yes I can hear you. MS BURTON Please can you stand to take the oath. THWANE ROTHO Duly sworn states MS BURTON Do you know Ms Mbekushe. MR ROTHO Yes, I know Sizakele Mbekushe. Yes, I know the mother too. MS BURTON MS SEROKE Sir, do you want to speak in Xhosa or Afrikaans. MR ROTHO I would like to speak in Xhosa. MS SEROKE We thank you for having come here to give evidence in this case. As a person who was there that day - can you tell us what happened. MR ROTHO Yes, I can tell you. On the 4 December we had a meeting. We were canvassing the youth for a march that was going to be on the 20th of December 1989. After that meeting, we left singing - toi-toiing. We toi-toiing to Swelisha where we stayed. When we get there in Swelisha, going down Street 10, toi-toiing. When we got to Street 10, a police van came. There were a lot of policemen inside. A Mr Greyling alighted from the car. He ask for one of us to go to him. I went with Comrade Brian Ngobo. He tried to find out what is happening. I told him that nothing is happening - we are just toi-toiing, we are going to disperse in no time, we were from a meeting. He was sitting on his veranda with his wife. His wife then said here are these dogs that threw stones at your house. I was not sure whether he was referring to the whole crowd or some people within the crowd. Mr Ketile ran inside. The group started dispersing - some people ran back towards Street 8. Other people ran upwards. After he shot had him, I told my - the other comrades that I am going to pick him up. As I went closer, Sizakele Mbekushe followed. I was running ahead of him. Ketile shot again. Mbekushe then murmured near me. He was saying he has got me. Mbekushe ran back - running up the street. I continued towards Martin even though there were shootings. I took Martin in my arms - a certain Comrade Dogo helped me. We went down the street. Noxegelo then said I must not go. She was saying that we should be looking after Martin. He - she was saying that she does not think that Sizakele will live up to the hospital. I believed her because she had an experience, she was a nurse in Namibia. I gave instructions to other comrades to take comrade Mbekushe to hospital. They came back telling me that comrade Mbkushe had died on the way to hospital. That is how we parted with comrade Mbekushe. MS SEROKE Thank you very much. I would just like you to clarify - Greyling said that you can continue toi-toiing. Ketile wife said that he knows who shot - who threw stones at the house and how many people were there. Do you know anything about this? MR ROTHO No I have no knowledge of such. But when we were toi-toiing on that day, there was no stone throwing. MS SEROKE As you picked up the children that had fallen, was it you and Sizakele? MR ROTHO Yes, it was. MS SEROKE When then was Sizakele shot by Ketile. MR ROTHO Sizakele were shot when both of us were going toward Martin to help him. MS SEROKE The person who shot first shot Martin Jumbo. So what you are saying is that Sizakele was shot whilst trying to help Martin. MR ROTHO Yes, it is so. MS SEROKE MR ROTHO MS SEROKE Perhaps we can ask Sizakele;s mother if he knows whether Ketile is still around. Thank you, I have no further questions. I will give to our Chairperson here to take over. MS BURTON Thank you very much for taking the trouble to make a statement and to be willing to come here today.