hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATION HEARINGS 1996-06-11 KIMBERLEY 2 https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55385&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/kimber/ct04407.htm CASE NO: CT/04407 VICTIM: DAVID MABEKA VIOLATION: TORTURED/DETAINED UNDER STATE OF EMERGENCY TESTIMONY BY: DAVID MABEKA CHAIRPERSON ADV POTGIETER Would you please take the following oath. DAVID MABEKA Duly sworn states ADV POTGIETER You may sit down. CHAIRPERSON David before I ask you to begin I would like to recognise Ms Papenfuss, a speaker from the Provincial Parliament. If you could please rise and Ms Xeospicsengwa a member of Parliament as well. Thank you for coming. David as is customary we always ask a Commissioner to assist you in the telling of your story. For your story we have asked advocate Potgieter to help you along as you go. I now hand over to advocate Potgieter. ADV POTGIETER Thank you Chairperson. David your story goes back to 1986 and it deals with your detention and what followed on that, is that correct? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER Thank you. MR MABEKA MS SOOKA [intervention] so that the witness can tell his story. When there is a noise it disturbs his flow of thought. We would request that you be quiet, thank you. ADV POTGIETER MR MABEKA I was at home when the State of Emergency was declared. I decided to sleep because I realised that the State of Emergency was now declared and PW said the police should arrest anybody that they suspect or they should arrest anybody who appears in public as a threat. I decided to stay at home and I just slept. We stayed there for a month and after a month we were called into their offices and they said to us - they said we should - we should know that we are going to stay 180 days and if they so wish they can add this number. They then transferred us to Bougroep Prison - we met other comrades from Vryburg and some comrades from Kimberley and from Warrington and there was also one comrade from Christiana. Some of the comrades from Barkley West were also there, we stayed in that Bougroep Prison for two months. It was towards September and the police arrived and they took us, it was now close to three months in detention. In that week we were busy trying to get information and his brother in law was working in Johannesburg and he said to me there is a temporary job where he working. We can go and do some temporary jobs there. On Monday the following week myself and Albert Benn got temporarily employed. I was - I was - I felt a bit safe now and I started forgetting about the ideas of fleeing the country. This left ear of mine gave me a lot of problems. I only heard funny sounds and I tried to see the doctors and I went to see a specialist - an ear specialist. They tested me with those machines and they said to me there is nothing wrong with my ear. I told them that there is something wrong with my ear because I cannot hear perfectly well. I only hear funny sounds and that was the end of it all. ADV POTGIETER David, thank you for that. How old were you when you were detained and you went through this ordeal that you just spoke about? MR MABEKA I was 20 years at that time - I was 20 years. ADV POTGIETER Were you given ever a reason why you were detained? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER Were you - you were schooling I gather, is that correct - at that time when you were detained? MR MABEKA Yes, I was doing Std 9 at the time, I was at school. ADV POTGIETER Were you - were you a youth leader or were you in the SRC or did you hold any positions like that? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER MR MABEKA Can you please repeat the question? ADV POTGIETER It was only your involvement in connection with the SRC that you wanted. That - that was only at the school where you were at that stage. You were not part of a bigger movement, no so? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER When you were detained and you were questioned it seems to have been only in connection with what happened at school because you say that the police accused you of teaching the children wrong things, to stay away from school and that so. It looks as if your detention had to do with some or other activities at school. Is that how you also understood it? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER So one can assume that you were detained because of that attempt to get a SRC at your school. That seems to be the only reason that suggest itself, no so? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER Now, did I understand the - your evidence correctly. It seems as if you were questioned and assaulted and so on just for the first - well the first few days of detention and after that you were simply locked up for the rest of three months and never questioned again. Was that - was that how it happened? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER Is it correct to say that what actually happened was that you were questioned over the first few days of - after you were detained and assaulted and everything else that you testified about and after that you were just locked away and you sat out the rest of about three months in custody just being locked up? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER And there were never any charges made against you, there was never any case made against you, is that correct? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER MR MABEKA They never explained to me why was I detained. ADV POTGIETER When you were transferred to the Transvaal Road Police Station, you were taken to the 6th floor and at that time you already heard about the 6th floor. What was it that you heard - what - about the 6th floor? MR MABEKA They told us that you are being put into a bag together with a cat and you are being put into that bath full of water. Those were things that I heard are happening on the 6th floor. When they showed me the bath I thought of such things and many comrades were also being tortured on the 6th floor. ADV POTGIETER And how did you feel when they took you to the 6th floor, what - what emotions did you have? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER [indistinct] when you were taken to the 6th floor in Transvaal Road Police Station, were you injured? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER [indistinct] injuries as a result of the previous assault when you got to the Transvaal Road Police Station? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER [indistinct] you - you got the injuries, did you see a doctor eventually? MR MABEKA I think three years passed before I could see a doctor. I say three years. ADV POTGIETER I assume that you stopped your schooling after the detention? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER Did you hear anything further about the charges that you made against the police that assaulted you? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER You said that you saw a doctor and you made your - the complaint to that doctor. You told that doctor that you were assaulted. You say that you were taken to a house. Can you still remember the doctors surname perhaps or anything about him? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER The policeman you referred to as Double Ice or Double Eyes, do you know what his real name is or his surname? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER Could - what is there that you feel that the Commission can do for you to be of some assistance? MR MABEKA ADV POTGIETER [indistinct] hand back to the Chairperson. MS SOOKA David I just want to ask you three questions so that I just can have some clarity. At the time when the police beat you, did they beat you on your head or did they beat you directly on your ear. Can you still remember that? MR MABEKA MS SOOKA MR MABEKA The doctor took the case and I never came to know what happened. I only realised that there was a case laid against them when Rosa came to me to tell me that I should drop the charges. MS SOOKA You mentioned that your friend James Morake was picked up with you. Was he with you when you were being beaten up? MR MABEKA At the beginning I said they took him to the other room where they assaulted him and they assaulted me in the next room. The only time when we were assaulted together was when they came back from the township - when they told us that our comrades threw stones at them. MS SOOKA One more question - you mentioned that when you went to Johannesburg a specialist treated you for your ears. Could you tell me what he said was wrong with your ear? MR MABEKA MS SOOKA You still could not hear properly in the one ear? MR MABEKA MS SOOKA ask you any questions. ADV NTSEBEZA David I just want to know again - in 1986 were there any legal advise centres in Kimberley and Beaufort and in Barkley West - do you know? MR MABEKA ADV NTSEBEZA Were there any advise centres in other words places where you could go and seek advise about your rights - like for instance where you could have gone and said whilst I was in detention I was assaulted by the police. I was detained for no reason and I would like to sue the police, can you assist me because I have no money. Did you - were there any centres like that in Barkley West or in Kimberley for that matter or were you aware that you could go to such places? MR MABEKA ADV NTSEBEZA [indistinct] the lawyers - black or white in the area to assist you with a claim against the police or was it also not easy in those days to approach any lawyers to assist you with those sort of things? MR MABEKA ADV NTSEBEZA Lastly can I conclude then from your answers that you never referred any civil claims to sue and claim money for damages for your ears and for the assault and for the wrongful detention that you underwent in those days? MR MABEKA ADV NTSEBEZA MR MABEKA MS SOOKA David we want to thank you for coming forward and giving your evidence. We are very-very conscious of the fact that our young people have paid a terrible price for freedom in this country. The previous witness lost an eye, you have lost the hearing - your hearing in your one ear but to despite all of that you have managed to complete matric and indeed you can be said to be a survivor of the struggle that our country has gone through. We hope that we can assist - we have heard your request that you meet with these policemen so that at least you can find out why they did what they did. We are also conscious of the fact that many of them remain in positions of power and that is part of the price that our country has to pay. We hope that we can help you and we thank you for having come forward today. Thank you for your evidence. Could we please rise while the witnesses leave. We will now break for tea.