hrvtrans YOUTH HEARINGS, SUBMISSIONS QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 1997-06-03 LEANDRA 1 VELELENI A TWALA JB2820 https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55531&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/leandra/twala.htm CHAIRPERSON I would like to call the next witness please, Veleleni Twala who will tell us a story also from Lebohang. MS SEROKE She is not here. CHAIRPERSON Yes, she is. Can you hear clearly through the earphones? You can, thank you. If you could please tell us who is sitting with you? MRS TWALA He is my son. CHAIRPERSON We would like to welcome him as well. You are going to tell us about two other sons, going back to 1982. Before you do that could I please ask you to stand and take the oath. VELELENI A TWALA (Duly sworn in, states). CHAIRPERSON Thank you. To help you with your story I will ask Joyce Seroke, please, to lead your evidence. Thank you, Joyce. MS SEROKE We welcome you Mrs Twala. We would like you to tell us about your son, Jabu, who was shot in the streets in Leslie on the 16th of January 1982. What I would like to ask from you is that. MRS TWALA What happened on that day, after the closing from work I could not understand Jabu's health. Then I requested the police station to take care of him in December. Then I will take him in January. After that Jabu was released and then he came back home during the day. Thereafter he went to town. He got shot by the police under whose custody he was. Then I was called in from home to come and, I was called in that my son was shot. MS SEROKE What was this son shot for, your son shot for? MRS TWALA The person who was with Jabu could not say any, told us that Jabu has not done anything. MS SEROKE According to your explanation you said Jabu was not feeling well after closing from work. So actually what made you to take Jabu to the police station to be taken care of, that made you not to take care of him yourself? MRS TWALA I was afraid that maybe he may be harmed, because he could not stay at home. He was just roaming in the streets. I think he was mentally ill. I suspected that he was not, mentally ill. Then I requested the police to take care of him until January after three months. MS SEROKE So when was he released from the police station? MRS TWALA I cannot remember. I am not so sure of the date. MS SEROKE According to your statement Jabu was shot by an Officer Botha. Did you go to Mr Botha and enquire about the reasons for shooting Jabu? MRS TWALA I did not go, because we were already fighting. MS SEROKE Who was fighting? MRS TWALA There were many police. MS SEROKE What did you do after Jabu was shot? MRS TWALA Nothing happened. Jabu was taken to the mortuary. Then when I went to collect his dead body I was told that the District Surgeon was not through with his body whereas he was already taken to another mortuary. Then I was assisted by one of the lawyers who phoned the Leslie Mortuary and instructed them to release my son so that I can be able to bury. MS SEROKE Are there any papers that were given explaining on how Jabu was killed? Is there any post mortem report given to you? Is that the death certificate or the report of the post mortem? MRS TWALA No, it is just the statement. MS SEROKE Okay. MRS TWALA That lawyer did not give us anything. MS SEROKE The lawyer, Mr Mamesa, who was sought to assist you by releasing the body of your son, was there any case that he opened regarding the shooting of your son? MRS TWALA No, he just wrote the statement and thereafter I was called in by another attorney stating that that, that attorney has disappeared with other people's statements. So I was advised to take that statement and take further steps with it. MS SEROKE Did you? MRS TWALA No, I did not take any, the statement was not taken. It was said that it is old. MS SEROKE According to your statement you told us about Josia Twala who was buried by the police in, whilst he was still in Davidton. What was Josia doing in Davidton? MRS TWALA He had visited his biological father in Davidton. MS SEROKE Was he a politician? MRS TWALA No, I had sent him to his biological father and whilst he went there he got shot. MS SEROKE Did you manage to get hold of his corpse? MRS TWALA No, I did not. MS SEROKE Did they show you where he was buried? MRS TWALA They came, the CIDs. MS SEROKE How did you get to know that Josia was killed and buried? MRS TWALA We had visitors from the police. MS SEROKE What did they say to you? MRS TWALA They asked me when did I last see Josia. I told them that I had sent him to his biological father and then I even gave them the dates. Told them that it was during the Easter holidays. Then they told me that that person has long been buried. He was buried by the police. MS SEROKE Did his father tell you that he did arrive? MRS TWALA The father told me that he did arrive, but we do not know what happened on his way back. MS SEROKE Your attorney, Mamesa, is he still around? MRS TWALA We do not know. It was said that he disappeared with other peoples statements. Then their office was taken over by another lawyer. MS SEROKE By the time Jabu got shot what was happening in Lebohang township? MRS TWALA Nothing was happening. MS SEROKE Was there no marches or protests or anything of that nature? MRS TWALA Jabu was shot long before the marches or the uprisings or anything. MS SEROKE Thank you Chairperson. CHAIRPERSON Thank you sis Joyce. Wynand Malan, do you have any questions? MR MALAN Mrs Twala, just again, you got the information, it seems, from a Mr Simon Mokwena. Is that correct? Who told you about your son's death? MS SEROKE Repeat. MR MALAN Sorry. My question, Mrs Twala, is in the statement that you gave us you say that the witness who saw the shooting was a certain Mr Simon Mokwena, it seems to me. Is that correct? Where is Mr Mokwena now? MS SEROKE It is the same gentlemen who was in, the Reverend. MR MALAN Is that the Reverend? Thank you. The translation is not getting to my headphones. So the information, I mean this is very difficult to understand, because the information in your statement says that your son, Jabu, was walking in the street. This Mr Botha, who is the police officer, walks up to him, tells him he is a racist and full of apartheid and he shoots him. I mean that is the information before us. That is very difficult to understand without a broader context. Do you have more information as to the context or should we speak to Mr Mokwena? MRS TWALA You can talk to Mr Mokwena. MR MALAN You have no other source of information except Mr Mokwena? MRS TWALA Mr Mokwena is the one who collected the body and took it to the mortuary. MR MALAN So was Mr Mokwena also present at the shooting? Did he see the shooting? MRS TWALA That can be explained by Mr Mokwena. MR MALAN Mrs Twala, if I may just ask you the question. Did Mr Mokwena tell you that he saw the shooting? That is really my question. I will ask him the detail, but to your knowledge did he see, did he observe Jabu's shooting? MRS TWALA I am not so sure whether he was present during the incident, but what he told me is that he is the one who collected the body and the blood. MR MALAN Okay, thank you very much Mrs Twala. CHAIRPERSON Tom Manthata. MR MANTHATA Mrs Twala, I think I have only got one question. Would you tell us whether, of course with, whether you knew the activities of your sons. That is whether you knew what they were actually doing, whether amongst their mates, that is those of his age group or just ordinary mates? MRS TWALA No, I did not know anything, because Jabu was employed and he was the only source of support from the family. MR MANTHATA And then Josia? MRS TWALA Josia was also employed. There was nothing funny that he was doing. MR MANTHATA You do not even know whether he could have been involved with the youths who were meddling in politics so to say? MRS TWALA No, my lord. MR MANTHATA Thank you. CHAIRPERSON Ma Twala, I would like to ask just one more question following on what Tom Manthata has asked. I mean, do you yourself, because you have had a long time to think about all this, do you think there was any political motive, firstly for Jabu's killing and secondly for Josia's disappearance? MRS TWALA I do not know, because Jabu was the first person to be shot in the township. CHAIRPERSON I mean, what, the story that you tell us is very full of sadness and it is very difficult for, I think it is difficult for all of us on the panel to know how to respond positively. We obviously sympathise with you very much for the story that you tell and we share your sadness, because we can understand that. On the one hand you have a son that is shot. On the other hand you have a son who just disappears and then there is no actual detail which will help you, because we all live by information. So it is a very difficult story for us to react to. What we will try and do, you have mentioned Mfondis Mokwena so we will try and follow up with him to see what more we can do. You do mention in your statement that you have suffered medical problems as well. If you could tell the briefers more about them, because there might be something that we can do there to help through the local authorities, but we would like to thank you very much for coming. Thank you Mama. MRS TWALA Ever since then my health deteriorated.