hrvtrans 1 F GQUBULE, HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS, SUBMISSIONS QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 1996-08-27 UITENHAGE 2 FUNDILE LAWRENCE GQUBULE https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=55998&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/uiten/gqubule.htm CCHAIRPERSON: Can we now ask Mr Fundile Lawrence Gqubule to take over. Thank you Mr Nkobese. We are going to ask the next witness to come forward. FUNDILE LAWRENCE GQUBULE: (sworn states) CHAIRPERSON: Let me start off by making sure about some details. Do you stay in number 26 Sedidi, Khayelitsha? MR GQUBULE: Yes, it is like that. CHAIRPERSON: At the time there was a shooting in Uitenhage in 1985, were you a resident here? MR GQUBULE: Yes, it is like that. CHAIRPERSON: What street were you staying? MR GQUBULE: It was number 14 at Gunsi Street. CHAIRPERSON: Is this Gunsi Street near this spot of shooting in Maduna Street? MR GQUBULE: No, it's not near. CHAIRPERSON: I observe that you are in a wheelchair. Is this as a result of an injury when there was a shooting? MR GQUBULE: Yes, it's like that. CHAIRPERSON: Could you explain, Mr Gqubule. Where were you on this particular day, and what actually happened? MR GQUBULE: On this day, on a Tuesday morning, I just had a bath and I heard some freedom songs and I went out and I saw a crowd moving toward Maduna. Then I stood on the roof of the house because I couldn't see clearly. At the time I UITENHAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 2 G GQUBULE was looking at Maduna, I saw a hippo that was driving amongst the people as the people were standing waiting for the bus. So I saw this hippo dispersing the people. Then there were some South African Defence Force next to Maduna, so I stood there watching the people who were being chased and the hippo trying to disperse the people. Then I saw a group of people moving down Maduna and so I went down the road and I went up Gonchi Street and next to the hall I joined the crowd and we were chanting freedom songs. There was a hippo just in front of us, and it drove past and stopped next to the John Wesley Church. They were chasing us. Then that is the last I can remember because I just heard some bullet sounds. CHAIRPERSON: At what stage were you hit by a bullet? MR GQUBULE: It was at Khlamthini when I was hit by a bullet and I heard some shooting sounds and I felt something on my right ankle and people were turning around and running and I don't know what happened. Then I lay there on the ground. I was the first person to be taken and I could see some people were being shot and I could see these people lying down there on the ground, they had some bottles placed on their hands. CHAIRPERSON: When you were lying there on the ground, what did you see? MR GQUBULE: I saw a helicopter. CHAIRPERSON: Were there any policemen that were moving up and down next to you as you were lying there on the ground? MR GQUBULE: Yes there were. CHAIRPERSON: What were they doing? MR GQUBULE: People were being kicked and they were being shot. Some were being pulled out of the bridge. UITENHAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 3 G GQUBULE CHAIRPERSON: In your statement you said there was a boy who was riding a BMX bicycle, do you see that boy here now? MR GQUBULE: Yes I do see him. CHAIRPERSON: What is his name? MR GQUBULE: His name is Kwanele Bucwa. CHAIRPERSON: You fell down and you were shot, then how did you get to the hospital? MR GQUBULE: As I was lying there in pain, I decided not to scream because most people were being killed and were screaming. I was then put into the first ambulance together with Nlungi Simclagahle and some other people. CHAIRPERSON: Now would you say how long did this shooting take place? MR GQUBULE: I would say for about an hour. CHAIRPERSON: As you were lying there, were they still shooting? MR GQUBULE: Yes, they were still shooting and people were coming from shacks in Nimkhi who were coming to join some people from section 15 and they were being shot. CHAIRPERSON: Was there anything that was said by these policemen at the time that there was shooting? What were they saying? MR GQUBULE: I didn't hear anything because I was really in deep pain at the time. CHAIRPERSON: How did this affect this shooting? How did it affect your body, how did it affect your health? Is there any medical treatment you are getting? MR GQUBULE: There is none. What happens is when it is overcast my body becomes stiff. CHAIRPERSON: Is that all you have to say Mr Gqubule, as to what you saw on this particular day? UITENHAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 4 G GQUBULE MR GQUBULE: I was transferred from the Uitenhage hospital to a hospital in Port Elizabeth were I met Lungi Sinlagashe. CHAIRPERSON: Were they also shot? MR GQUBULE: Yes they were. CHAIRPERSON: Would you explain what you saw in hospital, what did you see in hospital? MR GQUBULE: I saw a lot of policemen, they were all over the place, inside and outside, and some people were sneaking out of the hospital. CHAIRPERSON: Were there any policemen in the hospital? MR GQUBULE: Yes there were. CHAIRPERSON: Dr Khaan you say is the one who examined you in hospital, what did he say was the cause of the injuries you had? MR GQUBULE: He said they had shot me on the spinal cord and he said they could not take out the bullet because if they had to do that I would be completely paralysed. CHAIRPERSON: Now you say, as you are sitting there, there is a bullet that is embedded here in your body? MR GQUBULE: Yes it is there. CHAIRPERSON: Is this the cause of it that when it is overcast you feel some pain and your body becomes stiff? MR GQUBULE: Yes I would say that is the cause. CHAIRPERSON: Have you ever briefed any lawyer about this matter? MR GQUBULE: No. CHAIRPERSON: When you were called which in Jubilee Hall, what was happening? MR GQUBULE: I was in hospital at the time. CHAIRPERSON: So you actually did not go to Jubilee Hall? MR GQUBULE: No, I didn't go, it is only my parents who went UITENHAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 5 G GQUBULE there. CHAIRPERSON: What did they say to you when they came back from Jubilee Hall? MR GQUBULE: They said to me, there were discussions with the White people and they had been promised that some tax would be sent to them. CHAIRPERSON: Is there any cheque that your parents received? MR GQUBULE: No. CHAIRPERSON: Is there any money that was given to you for this shooting? MR GQUBULE: There is some money I got. Some people from the bank came to me whilst I was in hospital and so I signed, I was still in hospital at the time. CHAIRPERSON: Is that all you have to say? MR GQUBULE: On my way from 27, I was forced to go back to Cape Town because after I had been shot I had abscess and some fluid coming out of my knees, so I had to go back to Conradie Hospital because this left leg was giving me problems and it was to be amputated. CHAIRPERSON: By being here, Mr Gqubule, what is your actual wish, or your request to this Commission? MR GQUBULE: My request to this Commission is that they should see to it that we should have some sports fields for the paraplegics. I used to be a soccer player. CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Gqubule for your explanation, I can now hand over to the Chairperson so that if any of my colleagues here have got any questions they should pose them to you. PANEL MEMBER: Thank you Mr Gqubule, can you hear me? MR GQUBULE: Yes, I can hear you. UITENHAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 6 G GQUBULE PANEL MEMBER: How old were you when you were shot? MR GQUBULE: Round about 20 something. PANEL MEMBER: Mr Gqubule, we want to be able to determine the impact of your injuries. Would you please describe a day in your life starting when you get up, to determine how you cope on a day to day basis? MR GQUBULE: When I wake up in the morning, I just try to exercise a little bit and I take a bath. My wife usually dresses me and I have breakfast, and visit friends, nothing else. PANEL MEMBER: So it means that without the assistance and support of your wife, it would be difficult for you to function on a day to day basis, is that correct? MR GQUBULE: That is correct. PANEL MEMBER: You say that you were an athlete before your injuries? MR GQUBULE: That is correct. PANEL MEMBER: Before your injuries, what were your dreams and your plans for your future? MR GQUBULE: I was dreaming of being a sportsman and an educated person, but because of the fact that we were very poor and my parents and I did not have a lot of facilities. PANEL MEMBER: Mr Gqubule, this is a very difficult question but I need to ask you. On a day to day basis when you think about what could have been, and what is now, what goes through your mind, and what emotions are surfaced in you? MR GQUBULE: It is very painful to see myself in this condition. When I see other people I just think that if I was not in this condition I was going to be somewhere else just like a certain person. PANEL MEMBER: Thank you, my last question. I know you UITENHAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 7 G GQUBULE haven't really asked for anything, but you also say you are not receiving treatment. I ask again, is there anything you would like the commission to take care of? MR GQUBULE: I would like to have a better wheelchair than the one I have right now. PANEL MEMBER: And continued medical care? MR GQUBULE: I don't think I need any special treatment medication, besides the fact that sometimes I'm trembling. I think it is because of this bullet that is in my body. PANEL MEMBER: Thank you Mr Chairperson, I might want to come back to Mr Gqubule when we summarise at the end. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON: Ms Maya is going to lead the next witness. MS MAYA: Just before we leave Mr Gqubule. Your life is in this condition today, I want to get clarity, when you think back, who is responsible for this? MR GQUBULE: I can say it is Boers, I only know that I'm here today, I am like this because of the Boers. MS MAYA: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Gqubule.