hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS, SUBMISSIONS QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 1996-06-19 UMTATA 2 BOKVELA THOMAS PHULULA EC0240/96 https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=56061&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/umtata/phulula.htm MEMBER OF PANEL Mr Chairperson, I would like to call Mr Bokvela Thomas Phulula to the stand. CHAIRPERSON Mr Phulula, I welcome you this evening, on behalf of the Commission. I am going to ask you now to please tell your story. As you have listened, we have heard how the Government has violated people's human rights, torturing them. You are also here today with the same cry, that you have been tortured, ill-treated, such that you were also in danger of being killed. But still, that didn't deter you from making your standpoint. You told us that you were going to fight for our liberation, come what may. We salute you! We would ask you now to please carry on with your story before the Commission. Before that I am going to ask you to take the oath. Please stand up. BOKVELA THOMAS PHULULA (Duly sworn, states). CHAIRPERSON Tiny Maya will lead the witness. MS MAYA Thank you, Mr Chairperson. Mr Bokvela, before you start I would like to say that your names are Bokvela Phulula, people call you Lavenda, is that so? MR PHULULA Yes, that is so. MS MAYA Do you come from Ntambeni at (indistinct) here in Umtata, is that correct? UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 2 B T PHULULA MR PHULULA Yes, that is correct. MS MAYA Now in your story when you tell us about yourself you left your home when you were 28 years, going to Cape Town to look for work in 1963. Is that correct? MR PHULULA Yes, that's correct. MS MAYA Could you please start there, Sir, why did you go to Cape Town and which political organisations were you involved with at the time. MR PHULULA The reason why I went to Cape Town, I went to look for work. At the time I was a member of Mr Mandela's organisation, that is the ANC. The reason why I joined the ANC was because he was so tortured. That was the first thing. The reason why I went to Cape Town is I was tortured inside by the fact that he was tortured. His torture affected me inside. Then I was offered employment in Woodstock. But then I was arrested and my uncle found me at Pollsmoor. At the time I was arrested for the pass, because I didn't have my pass. I was still working. While I was still working they also fetched me again. The same place where I was working. I was again arrested and put in Pollsmoor. These boers were still asking me tell us, man, we don't trust you very much, which organisation are you affiliated with. I said I am in the same organisation as Mandela. They said to you know him. I said yes, I know him. Where does he come from? I said he comes from Umtata. Then after that they left. I slept. My uncle came in the morning, trying to release me, because he was under the impression that I was arrested under the pass laws. But they said no, I was not there. That is what they said, the boers, they said I was not there, Phulula is not here. UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 3 B T PHULULA Then I went to a court at Observatory. While I was still in the police van, I had been beaten up, they were still beating me up. They were competing in beating me up. I told them, even when I got there, I said I am still saying the same thing, but I was saying then, I told them that I come from the rural areas, I am from Umtata, and I didn't know that by coming to Cape Town I have sinned, because I know that Cape Town is still South Africa, I am not from overseas. But now apparently now the magistrate now didn't like what I was saying. Then he said no, I must be taken down, I must be taken down from the courts, from the stand, I was beaten up so much that day, I wished for the sun to come up. I was beaten up the whole night. They tried all kinds of things to torture me. That whole week they used to come just to beat me up only. Then on the second week, they took me again. They fetched me from my cell. Then I said you murderers, there is no other thing that you came to fetch me here for, you only want to kill me. Because it looks like to me then that you are murderers, that is the only thing that you know here. You came here under the pretext that you are preachers, because you came with a Bible, and you made us to believe in the Bible, and now you have shown your true colours. You are now murderers, we can now see that. I know that you are murderers. Then the magistrate said no, this one must go straight to Mandela, he thinks the same way as Mandela. I said yes, I am still saying this to you that you are murderers, I know that you want to kill me, you want to drown me. MS MAYA Were you sentenced? MR PHULULA No, I was never sentenced, this whole time. UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 4 B T PHULULA Even then I was taken again. We were in the Observatory court all the time. I was again taken from the stand into the van. Right in the police van they again assaulted me so much, I was never beaten up so much. Such that even yesterday I had to go through an operation. The doctor who was taken care of me was Dr Bekker at the time. Let me continue. I stayed in the prison for too long. I didn't even get food sometimes. I would sleep without anything to eat. Things got better when one man from Gauteng, his clan name is Dlamini, I can't remember his name. I was with him in the cell. I found out now that we were thinking the same way politically. We stayed in that cell for the whole year. Now we started a second year with this man. MS MAYA Let me interrupt you and take you back to where you were taken into Observatory. What was your crime, what were you accused of? MR PHULULA I was only accused of being in Cape Town with no permission, meaning that I was arrested under the pass laws, and that I know that Cape Town was just part of my country and I didn't know that I was in a foreign country by being in Cape Town. MS MAYA When did you come out of the cell and what happened? MR PHULULA I was released from the cell on the day, it was at two o'clock, two am, I heard my name being called. They said Beti Phulula. I got out. When I got out I saw that there was a van, a police van outside. I got in. They said go in "kaffer". Still, they still continued beating me up. This one, my cell mate, they did the same thing to him, they beat him up again. Then there was another man from another UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 5 B T PHULULA cell but I think he was from Ciskei. Then we were three in this police van. While I was still looking at that, there were women now, four women coming from the women's side. They were put in the cell that we were. Nobody was asking anyone about anything. I just said to the other men, now we are going to be killed. I said these people who are pretending to be preachers and believers of God are now going to kill us, Dlamini, let's pray our own prayers, let us use our ancestors' God, Khamata. Then we started to pray in the police van. The van went on. It passed through De Aar. It went through Prieska. I said to Dlamini, Dlamini, I am looking for, I just want to escape, do you know any place here. We came across a big river. I said to Dlamini, where are we going. He said to me, you see, Duma, when we are here, we are going into the Ovambos, to the Ovambo area, which is in the North West, in the South West Africa. When we get there, when we get out we must just grab their guns, we must not give them any chance, we must just grab their guns. Even if one us gets shot, but let us just grab their guns. Then what happened. We went through another town which I think was for Vendas. I did not know these places. I used to ask Dlamini next to me. We got there around half past one. That was now in Tzaneen. I can still have its picture in my head. They put in petrol into their car. They said to us here are Xhosa-speaking men. They said to us you guys are going to be killed, you are not going back to your homes. That's when I started being shocked. They said what are you saying, I said what are you saying. They said there have been many Xhosa people who have been passing here, they don't come back, you are also not coming back; I UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 6 B T PHULULA am advising you Xhosa people, when these lions approach you, do not run away from them, because they are used to this. Don't run away from these lions, you are going to be introduced to some lions. I said to Dlamini, let's pray again. Then we started to pray together with these four women. The police van passed the Tzaneen town. I again asked Dlamini. Dlamini said no, we are in Angola. This is now Angola and this is Maputo in front of us. That other side is Tzitzikamma. I said where are we being taken to Dlamini, where are we going to be killed at, are they taken us so far away that even our families cannot even retrieve us any more. Anyway, the van continued. It went deep into the forest. It went on and on and on. Now Dlamini told me that we are now very near Maputo. It stopped and it was trying to station properly. It was now facing back where we were from. It was not around three pm. MS MAYA Excuse me, I would like to interrupt you, Sir. Is there anyone here in this hall called Phila Xhomba? You can go on, Sir. MR PHULULA I was again called Beti Phulula. Then I got out of the van. We were all called by our names. There were three boers and then they said you said Cape Town is your country, now that is not your country, this is your country. There are many dogs around here, they are going to guide you, so you can build up your houses here, build your new homes in this place. I said Dhlamini, it looks like our plan is not going to work. What kind of a place is this where you are asked to build homes in? These are forests. We were put in a forest. They didn't leave us any food in UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 7 B T PHULULA this forest, we were just dropped there. MS MAYA Were there any people in this forest? MR PHULULA No, there were no people. MS MAYA When was the last time you saw people in this whole distance that you had travelled? MR PHULULA The last time we saw people was somewhere in the town. We would see scattered houses, belonging to the Tshanganese. Then we were taken off into the deepest part of the forest. Then we were told on the other side it was Maputo and the other side it was Angola and the other side it was Tzitzikamma. I said you know, Dhlamini, do you know these places. Dhlamini said yes, I know these places. Now these boers said to us you "kaffers", this is where you are supposed to be now. You must never put your foot in Cape Town, build your homes in here, never go back to Cape Town. Then they left us there. I said to the other men, are you aware that we are going to be left here now, among these lions. Let us kneel down and pray again, before we make any further moves. We did. We knelt down and we prayed. After that let's retrace our steps, let's use the wheels, the tracks of the wheels and go back. We did that. After a short distance we saw these lions. When I saw the first one, I said to myself oh, these are the lions that the Tshingaans had told us about. We were told not to run, we were only told that we must look at the lion. At that time we were only urinating ourselves, there was no control at all, because we were frightened. We all did this. We didn't have even one single half a weapon with us. MS MAYA What time was it by now, Sir? MR PHULULA It was now after three pm. UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 8 B T PHULULA MS MAYA How long did you look at this lion? MR PHULULA After a time this lion simply just ran away, it turned around and it left and it started to roar. There were the others now that started to approach. But now these lions turned back so we continued walking. We walked until the following morning. When we got into the town at around eight am, I went to go and buy five loaves of bread. This is the money that I had with me the time I was arrested. When this man saw this money, he looked at my money as if it wasn't real money. But then he took it and we got the bread and we ate. We didn't walk a long distance. We just walked a short distance. MS MAYA Is that how you survived from these lions? MR PHULULA Yes, that's how we survived from the lions. I am sure that the boers think that we were killed by the lions. They told themselves that we were dead. Because there were many who went there who had been taken to that forest, people were made meals for those lions. But because of the advice that we got from the Tshangaans we survived. MS MAYA Now when you got to Tzaneen you were fortunate to get employment at a contractor in Tzaneen. MR PHULULA Yes, that's correct. I said to Dhlamini, let's see if we can't get any employment in this town, because we can't go back home barefoot. So we left the other ones. Dhlamini and myself went to look for a job at the contractor. When we got there we got employment. They even got us houses to stay inside the premises of the contractor. I had a small amount of money with me but I left some of it with these other ones that were with us, especially the women, so that they can try and take care of themselves. Then Dhlamini and I continued working with the contractor. UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 9 B T PHULULA MS MAYA So when did you come back home? MR PHULULA I came back home in 1966. MS MAYA And since you left Cape Town in 1965? MR PHULULA That's right, then I came back in 1966. I went back home. MS MAYA Are there any details which we have left out of your story? If you have any details we can conclude. MR PHULULA When I came back home I could feel still that the bruises that I had were still hurting me. The person who tried to make me survive and the reason why I am still alive today was that doctor. He is the one who tried to make me go to the hospital. But I still have a problem with the operation that I had on the side of my body and here on my head. Dr Benjamin tried to give me a referral letter to go to the hospital. That is where I went through the operations. I said to them even though you are making these operations on me, please try and take care, I don't want - I want to wake up after the operations. So they said to me we have to give you a general anaesthetic. I said no, can't you do a local anaesthetic, just like when you go to a dentist. Well, they did inject me and they operated on me. I kept on going back to the doctor, according to Dr Betja. Even now as I am telling you, I have a certain big debt that I didn't pay Dr Betja's debt. MS MAYA Do yu have any wish that you would like the Commission to help you out with? MR PHULULA Because my health has deteriorated I would like that the Government that we fought for, can please try and give us reparation. Because now these boers, I know that it is difficult for the boers now, but I don't have grudges against them. When I look at them I even feel sorry for UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 10 B T PHULULA them, as if they are now, as if they are orphans. But it is all right, we can still say with these boers, even though they have killed a lot of our people. As I am telling you now, one of my brothers died in Sasolburg, he was also killed by these boers. I am the only one left at home. MS MAYA Thank you, Sir. I am now going to hand you over to the Commissioner, so that if my colleagues have any questions they have the opportunity to ask you. CHAIRPERSON Are there any questions? MEMBER OF PANEL Sir, I have a couple of questions for you. You said in your statement you were three men and four women. Do you know the names of these people? MR PHULULA I only know one and that is Dhlamini, the one I used to walk around with. I don't know whether it was Jackson, but I know that he was from Soweto. When we came back he got off in Gauteng at the Park Station. We left the others at a spot where we parted. I don't know how they came back, I think they came back on foot. MEMBER OF PANEL Do you know their names? MR PHULULA No, I don't know their names. MEMBER OF PANEL How long did you stay with them? MR PHULULA I didn't stay long with Dhlamini. I stayed alone for a long time. I was regarded as a murderer. MEMBER OF PANEL While you were kept in Pollsmoor, were there any other people that you were arrested with or were you alone? MR PHULULA We were many and there were the other three that were put in the other cell, but now I was alone in this cell. They were under the impression that I was the one who was influencing the others, inciting violence. MEMBER OF PANEL Were there any other people who can bear UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 11 B T PHULULA evidence of your arrest in Pollsmoor? MR PHULULA Yes, there was another man although I wouldn't even know where he was taken from Pollsmoor. There were also others, even though I won't be able to tell their names. It is a long time now. MEMBER OF PANEL At the time of your arrest, you said you were only arrested because you were a member of a political organisation? MR PHULULA Yes, that's correct. MEMBER OF PANEL Were you a member? MR PHULULA Yes, I did tell them that I was a member of the ANC. And I told them that you have arrested Mandela for no reason. MEMBER OF PANEL Were you in Cape Town at the time? MR PHULULA Yes, I was in Cape Town. MEMBER OF PANEL Were there other people that were members of the ANC at the time, who are still alive, who can give evidence of this? MR PHULULA I can still remember some young men who when I was coming from Cape Town, I realised that they had already left for Lusaka. MEMBER OF PANEL Thank you, Sir, very much. MEMBER OF PANEL Mr Phulula, can I ask you something. When you escaped from where you were, did you say it was Tzaneen? MR PHULULA Yes, it was Tzaneen. MEMBER OF PANEL Did you ever tell anyone about this? MR PHULULA No, I didn't tell anyone, I only told my father. I took my father aside into the kraal and then I told him the story. Because at this time now, the men in government was Kazier Mantanzima. I said to my father, father this is how things were, I am from such-and-such a UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 12 B T PHULULA place. I said my father, please don't cry. So then he stopped. He said don't say this any more, because you will be arrested, you will be arrested again if you say this to anyone. MEMBER OF PANEL Is there anyone except your father who you told the story to? MR PHULULA No, there is no one at all. MEMBER OF PANEL Where is your father right now? MR PHULULA My father passed on. MEMBER OF PANEL Did you ever hear anything, Mr Phulula, maybe over the radio, or even somebody who saw something in the newspapers about the story of your arrest in Tzaneen? Was there anyone else who told the story? MR PHULULA Yes, I heard a little about this. As I am telling you this, there are other people now who are coming out. Because it is now evident that I was not alone. Well, now I am tell you that there are other people who are coming out now, who are telling the story. MEMBER OF PANEL Who are these people? MR PHULULA These are sons to those people who I was with. They said the same thing you went through was the same thing that my father went through. MEMBER OF PANEL Could you please elaborate, Mr Phulula? Who are these young men you are talking about, this torture? MR PHULULA It is Mr Mandosini from the municipality. When I talked to him one day he said to me his grandfather was also in Tzaneen, but apparently he was poisoned, so he didn't live for long. But then when he came home then he died. CHAIRPERSON Ms Gobodo? MS GOBODO-MADIKIZELA Mr Phulula, I am going to ask about UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE 13 B T PHULULA the contractor. What was the name of the contractor that you worked for in Tzaneen? MR PHULULA It was called Roberts. MS GOBODO-MADIKIZELA What did you do there, Sir? MR PHULULA I was pushing a wheelbarrow. CHAIRPERSON Thank you, Mr Phulula, for coming to the Commission. We hope that you have taken your oath seriously, when you were giving your statement here. We hope that what you are telling us today is the truth. Like we have said before, we are going to investigate. We have said even the same thing to the others before you. But we are going to try and we are going to try by all means, but it is going to be very difficult when everybody who can bear evidence of what you are telling us, is now all dead. UMTATA HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE