hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS, SUBMISSIONS QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 1997-06-05 WITBANK 1 MISS MARTHA H E JOUBERT JB0157 https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=56149&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/witbank/1witjoub.htm MR MALAN Before we start I would also like to just publicly thank the Foundation for Equality before the Law who assisted us greatly through the last fifteen months in accessing potential victims of Gross Human Rights Violations, especially what was perceived to be from the old South Africa and the participation of people from the old order in this process of finding Gross Human Rights Violations, getting to findings as to who were victims or not has made a great contribution I believe to national unity in order to allow us in a sense to frame the past as one of victims of a conflict where there were also perpetrators who caused the violations. Looking at it in a different paradigm from simply the old confrontational dimension of the Liberation versus the System I think we are learning largely that we also now have a situation where we acknowledge that we have victims from all sides of that conflict and we have found perpetrators in all sides to the conflict and if we can start identifying with each other, on the basis of all of us being victims and all of us also associated in some way or another, with perpetrators. Not to take a judgmental view on it, not even to look at it in terms of specific moral positions but just finding each for the sake of reconciliation and national unity in the future. There will of course be a number of other issues that we will have to discuss and decide on but the fact that the Foundation for Equality before the Law has assisted us greatly at their own expense in bringing forward witnesses from the so called old order, is something that we as a Commission, especially in this Province, really appreciate. MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN Can you tell us what your experience of this was? What went through your mind at the time? MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN When you talk about the shock , what can you say about it to-day? MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN Do you have any information as to how this happened. MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN Was it the N.B.S. building? MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN Did you ever hear whether the matter was followed up? Did anyone get arrested? Where there any rumours in the town or people talking about it? MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN Where to you think the bomb came from or did it just get there by itself? MISS JOUBERT What we heard was that it was planted in a car. It was a motor car bomb. Someone put the bomb in a motor car. MR MALAN MISS JOUBERT The time that the bomb exploded was the time that most people were going to work early in the morning. Some people were already at word. I cannot say who planted the bomb. MR MALAN You never thought what connection there was and who possibly could have done it or who possibly would do it or what their motives would have been? MISS JOUBERT No. MR MALAN Really not? This was not the first bomb explosion here was it or was it according to your knowledge? MISS JOUBERT Yes, this was the first one I knew of. MR MALAN MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN To the best of your knowledge the only bomb which exploded in Witbank is the one to which you refer. MISS JOUBERT Yes. MR MALAN And you yourself, you say that you try not to think about it. Do you personally have any after effects of this incident? Does it still worry you? MISS JOUBERT Yes. MR MALAN MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN MISS MKHIZE DR RANDERA Can you hear that? MISS JOUBERT DR RANDERA Just try it again. TRANSLATOR Excuse me, we can only translate from Afrikaans to English and not from English to Afrikaans. DR RANDERA Sorry, our apologies. MR MALAN My colleague, Commissioner Miss Hlengiwe Mkhize has asked whether I can question you on her behalf. Did you ever any clinical treatment? Did you ever receive any treatment from a Psychologist or a Psychiatrist to help you overcome the shock that you experience? MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN Why did you go to hospital? MISS JOUBERT They took all of us there to be treated for shock. It was mostly for the shock that we went. MR MALAN You never stayed in hospital overnight did you? MISS JOUBERT No. MR MALAN MISS JOUBERT Yes, I did receive notification just after the incident when I was still working at Jet Stores. They said they will let us know when and where we must go but they never contacted us again. MR MALAN MISS JOUBERT No. MR MALAN They also never informed as to who was being accused of the bombing? MISS JOUBERT No, they never said. MR MALAN To the best of your knowledge, was it a criminal case? Was somebody implicated in connection with the bomb explosion? MISS JOUBERT Yes. MR MALAN You never followed it up nor did you hear anything more thereafter? MISS JOUBERT MR MALAN Thank you very much. What made you decide to actually come and speak to us to-day? MISS JOUBERT I already made a statement to Mr Killian and he suggested that I should come to the Truth Commission and speak again. MR MALAN Just for information, Mr Killian is one of the investigators in our office. Fanie Killian, I take it? How did you get to hear about him? MR MALAN So he must have got your name somewhere? MISS JOUBERT Yes. MR MALAN Thank you very much. DR RANDERA MISS JOUBERT Yes. DR RANDERA Was that quite a big structure for the police in the area? MISS JOUBERT No. DR RANDERA My second question is, according to our document a young man was killed subsequent to the bombing and the report that was released was that he may have been responsible for the placing of the bomb in the bank. The one that you have been talking about. Do you remember anything about that? MISS JOUBERT DR RANDERA So as far as you are aware, there was no enquiry into the bombing? MISS JOUBERT No. DR RANDERA Thank you. Are there any other questions from the panel?