hrvtrans HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATION HEARINGS PIETERMARITZBURG https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=56229&t=&tab=hearings https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/hrvtrans/hrvpmb/pmb7_8.htm MR SINGH Mr Zondi, where do you currently reside? --- I reside at KwaMnyandu. Sorry, could you just repeat that please? --- I reside at KwaMnyandu. No, where do you currently reside at? --- Well, it's a long time. I think I was born there, and my father was born also there, and my grandfather was born there. All right, so you're telling us how long you live in this place. --- Ja. All right. You've been called upon to give evidence regarding the Seven Day War. Can you proceed and tell us your story then regarding the attacks which commenced on the 25th of March or 26th of March 1990. --- I won't commence from this other part, but I want to start differently, because there were police who used to come frequenting my house even before the 25th, and they will come harass me at my place. And shortly after they leave my house an Inkatha youth will come to harass my kids when I am away at work. This took place four times. The first thing I want to say is that the police came with one white policeman, and he said to me, "You see, all the boys have repented, they are no longer UDF. You are the only one, and your boys, who haven't repented yet. Now, we do trust and hope that when you repent, especially that you are educated, and your boys are educated as well, all the boys in KwaMnyandu will repent from UDF." And I knew exactly what that meant. The second time around they knocked at the window. Unfortunately the window was not properly closed so they came through the window. They collected all the toys that belonged to the kids, they took them with, also took us and the kids. And when we got there, if I am not mistaken it was on a Friday, we were there detained on Friday, Saturday and Sunday, and we appeared in front of the Magistrate. When we got there the police who arrested us were not present. The case was postponed and we were told to leave and go back home. When we got home the day came for the court case and we went back, and the police still did not turn up and the Magistrate therefore released us. Again the police came at night. Now, on that day there were neighbours, females, who came to our house, because we had a big house. And I suddenly heard from one of the ladies saying, "There are the police. I can see the torches." And I woke up and I also tried to peep through the window. I could see that they were just approaching and they were nearby now. So they were approaching the second gate, because I have two gates, and I asked, "Who are you?" They said, "We are police." And I asked them, "Why now are you hiding?" I rushed to the kids. Before even entering the bedroom, the children's bedroom, I heard a gunshot, and that's the gunshot that left so much blood oozing. And one of them asked, "Why did you shoot?" and the other said, "No, it's them who shot." And they took the boy who was shot. Who was shot then? --- Ja. Who? Who got shot? --- The police that shot I don't know. Your story is the sad one, Mr Zondi. We can tell from the way you relate your story. You know, you've gotten into the details of the story, and we can tell from the way you relate that you are so highly affected. Now, tell us about the cattle. What happened to those cattles and so forth. Did they sell them? --- I had cattle. (Incomplete) ... took the cattle, did they sell those cattle, or what happened to those cattle? --- Oh, now I understand. They took those cattle to slaughter them, because on Thursday one of them said that - I can't even remember his name - said, "You see the soldiers doing /"this this and that. I did slaughter two Zondi's cattle." Some were taken to Elandskop Mafuza(?) where they were distributed respectively to some people, and two of those cattle were returned. They came back to my place. They came, two cattle. Now, one day as I was just taking a walk, and hiding at the same time so that I may not be seen, I took those two cattle. I told the boys that I have seen my cattle and I will take them with to Edendale. Unfortunately, most unfortunately, they came to steal them from Edendale. You've also said that when there was a visitor - one visitor was hurt, was injured on the arm and was admitted to the hospital. What hospital was the visitor admitted to? --- He was injured on his arm. He is though far away from our place. Where is that? What are you talking about? --- He did not die. He is still alive. No, Mr Zondi, I don't get you, I am lost now. You say the one who was injured on his arm is still alive. You mean the boy who was injured? --- Yes, he is alive. I have seen him, although his arm was highly affected. You mean now his arm never functioned quite well after that? --- I don't think so because he was a Malombo boy, where my sister was married to. I think we should encourage that family as well, you know, so that we get the full details of the story direct from them and see how we can help them. --- I will try my best to meet the uncle, because the uncles are still there at Mnyandu. They are still a few of those who never left the area. I can get back to the uncles. My last question, Mr Zondi. At Mnyandu and the neighbouring places what's there now? Are there any houses still, or how does the area look like now? Has it changed completely? --- You see, the houses that were not attacked the owners went back to occupy those houses, but as for my area I think it was only one or two families that went back. I also from time to time go and see how things are going on. My kids are there, but I am not there. And there's no day when I've arrived at that place and see nothing - and discover nothing. Every day damage was taking place. Mr Zondi, you've said in your statement there was a white policeman, and the policeman came to you and said you and your boys have to repent and join the Inkatha organisation so that the rest of others can easily follow. Would you perhaps tell us his name? --- Yes, I know, but I won't mention his name because I may be killed tomorrow. That is the very policeman that gained entry through the window, and the other one. They came inside the house through the window. Well, I do understand why you don't want to tell us his name. Maybe some other time you will tell us. But you also said there were policemen that came to arrest you and you were detained for the whole weekend. Do you know those police now who arrested you? --- I know this white policeman, because he was also there, but when we went to the police station he drove past and he handed us over to others, the black ... (intervention) You mean the black policemen? --- No, they were mixed black and white policemen. Do you know their names? What I want is their names. --- You mean the police? Yes. --- No, I won't disclose their names. In fact I only know one police because he was so much known, notorious because of things he used to do. Otherwise the rest of the policemen I don't know their names. Mr Zondi, what court did you appear in that Monday and then where the case was withdrawn against you? Which court was that? --- I beg your pardon? Which court did you appear in, which Magistrate's Court? --- It was just Vulindlela Court. Thank you. Which of the two courts there? There are two courts. We can go back and look at the records, you see. --- At Vulindlela. There is only one court there, but it is divided into two rooms. That's right. Mr Zondi, we've discovered here that the media people did come to you to converse with you from overseas in Holland. I think those were the ones you met on your way. We will be showing that picture on Thursday morning at 9.00 am. In case you are interested to take a look on that photo please do come and look at it. We think you are the one who talked to those two men. --- Yes, different white men came. Others were from Scotland. I have forgotten the others where they were coming from, and they were with Peter. They were coming from Holland, as I have said. On Thursday morning at 9.00 am we will be showing that picture. Please, we invite you to come and take a look on the picture. Mr Zondi, thank you very, very much. The story that you have told us is a story of political intolerance, not a story of war. I agree with you that war implies a clash of two armed groups or two armed forces, and it doesn't mean the murder of innocent people. You said that you and your father and your grandfather were all born in KwaMnyandu, and it seems that on that one day in March that the work of three generations was destroyed. And now as a pensioner you have ... (intervention) Please, good people, do not embarrass us. Please don't embarrass us. The Commissioner is trying to talk to Mr Zondi, but you are making noise. Please, we call that you maintain order and behave yourselves. This is embarrassing, for your information. ... and that as a pensioner you are now left without a home and without those assets that you saved up for your old age. And you might wonder why you have been asked to go through this again, to tell us your story, and as difficult as it is for you it's important to do what you and your brother a few minutes ago did, to tell your story about this event. This story has never been told officially before. Statements have been taken, but this story has never ever been told officially, and you and the other witnesses who have given evidence today have told that story, and this enables us to make recommendations to the Government, to the State President, as to how you and the many other people who suffered during that time in 1990 should be helped. So it is important that you come here today, and we thank you for having had the courage to come and relive those days. Thank you very much indeed. --- I also thank you very much, and I would like to add that - well, in fact I have been also wondering all the time since this six years being away from our places or from our homes, that there was just a dead silence about what events that happened at KwaMnyandu, KwaShange and Gezabuso, and I also thank you very much that you have just given us this chance to express ourselves. And I wish to add that my motto, my aim, is peace. If then the Government would try to help us, or to boost us of what we lost, then we shall be pleased. And we are willing to have peace with those people, because I seemingly do not see any reason why they had just to attack us having not yet quarrelled with them. So I would like that, well, of course there should be peace, especially at Mnadi region. Thank you very much, Mr Zondi. We also hope that the work of this Commission can play some small part in bringing about peace and reconciliation in those areas. --- Thank you.