<?xml version="1.0" encoding="windows-1252"?>
<hearing xmlns="http://trc.saha.org.za/hearing/xml" schemaLocation="https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/export/hearingxml.xsd">
	<systype>decisions</systype>
	<type>AMNESTY DECISIONS</type>
				<names>JOHAN HENDRIK LE ROUX,EUGENE ALEXANDER DE KOCK,WILLEM ALBERTUS NORTJE,EUGENE FOURIE,DAVID JACOBUS VAN DER WALT,THAPELO JOHANNES MBELO,SIMON MAKOPO RADEBE</names>
		<matter>AM4148/96,AM0066/96,AM3764/96,AM3767/96,AM3769/96,AM3785/96,AM7249/96</matter>
				<decision>GRANTED</decision>
	<url>https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/hearing.php?id=59552&amp;t=&amp;tab=hearings</url>
	<originalhtml>https://sabctrc.saha.org.za/originals/decisions/2001/ac21272b.htm</originalhtml>
		<lines count="99">
		<line number="1">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>DECISION</text>
		</line>
		<line number="2">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="3">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="4">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="5">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>Before commencing with discussing   the specific issues I need to set out a frame for their consideration:-</text>
		</line>
		<line number="6">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="7">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="8">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="9">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>The requirement of full disclosure   of all relevant facts in my opinion has therefore to be interpreted as follows:-</text>
		</line>
		<line number="10">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="11">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="12">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="13">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="14">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>I now turn to the second issue,   that is the presence of Pienaar or not at the scene of the killing of the Deceased.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="15">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="16">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="17">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>I would not rule out the possibility   that they may be genuinely mistaken about Pienaar&#039;s presence, them having been   involved in a number of other incidents with him for which they all apply for   amnesty.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="18">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="19">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="20">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="21">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="22">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="23">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>I now turn to the issue relating   to the authorisation of the abduction, assault and killing of the Deceased.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="24">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="25">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>This includes:-</text>
		</line>
		<line number="26">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="28">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="30">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="31">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="32">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>To be blunt, it is not only inconceivable   and thus highly improbable but practically impossible for the events to have   all occurred on the 25 September or within a single day:-</text>
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		<line number="33">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="34">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="35">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="36">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="37">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>I now turn to the specific issue   of authorisation for the abduction, assault and killing of the Deceased.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="38">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="39">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>The 1st and 3rd Applicants&#039; evidence   was to the effect that up to the time of the abduction, no order had been given   or decision had been taken that the Deceased was to be killed.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="40">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="41">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>His application for amnesty for   the killing of the Deceased is based on his omission to intervene when informed   by Kleynhans at Vlakplaas, on the day following the abduction, that it had been   decided to kill the Deceased to protect the identity of individuals and the   Vlakplaas operation, to which replied that it was &quot;not a problem&quot;   or it was &quot;not my problem&quot;.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="42">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>It seems to me that the evidence   of the 1st Applicant is being rejected on a balance of probabilities mainly   on account of his evidence related to:</text>
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		<line number="43">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="44">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="45">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="46">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="47">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="48">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="49">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="50">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="51">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="52">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="53">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="54">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="55">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>And then later he testified:</text>
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		<line number="56">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="57">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="58">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="59">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="60">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="61">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>And a little further:-</text>
		</line>
		<line number="62">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="63">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>&quot;Wie is die ons waarvan u   nou praat? --- Ek en die beskuldigde&quot;</text>
		</line>
		<line number="64">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>and a little further again:-</text>
		</line>
		<line number="65">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="66">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="67">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>And lastly a quote from the Goldstone   Commission where the 3rd Applicant testified, quoted to him in cross-examination:-</text>
		</line>
		<line number="68">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>&quot;Ons het hom maar ondervra   en toe besef ons sal nie hierdie man nie kan los nie, want as hy nou hier uitgaan,   gaan daar moeilikheid wees&quot;.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="69">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>It should be borne in mind that   the evidence of the 3rd Applicant at the trial was evidence against the 2nd   Applicant, not against the 1st Applicant and that the latter had no opportunity   to cross-examine the 3rd Applicant so as to introduce his version.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="70">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="71">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="72">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>Secondly he testified that he   would have done nothing without the approval or order of the 2nd Applicant,   not even taking orders from the superiors of the 2nd Applicant without having   cleared such orders with the 2nd Applicant.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="73">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="74">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>The version of the 2nd Applicant   on the issue of authorisation in my view presents the most improbabilities and   contradictions of the 3 versions.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="75">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="76">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>This brings me to a consideration   of the provisions of Sections 20(1)(b), 20(2) and 20(3) of the Act.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="77">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>Section 20(3) is clear in its   wording that its provisions merely serve as criteria to be considered in deciding   whether a particular act is an act associated with a political objective as   suggested in Section 20(2).</text>
		</line>
		<line number="78">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="79">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="80">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>As far as the 2nd Applicant is   concerned, special consideration has to be given to the criteria stipulated   in Section 20(3)(d), (e) and (f).</text>
		</line>
		<line number="81">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="82">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="83">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>Concerning the provisions of Section   20(3)(e) it is clear on evidence that the 2nd Applicant bona fide believed that   he was acting on behalf of the State, albeit to my judgement not in terms of   an expressed order.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="84">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="85">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>Taking into account the provisions   of Section 20(2)(b) and having jointly considered all the criteria in Section   20(3), I am of the opinion that the abduction, assault and killing of the Deceased   as it relates to the 2nd Applicant were indeed acts associated with a political   objective, committed in the course of the conflicts of the past as envisaged   in Section 20(1)(b).</text>
		</line>
		<line number="86">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>The final question to be decided   then is whether the 2nd Applicant, given his evidence on the authorisation,   has made a full disclosure as envisaged in Section 20(1)(c).</text>
		</line>
		<line number="87">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="88">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
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		<line number="89">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="90">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>In the event I am satisfied that   the 2nd Applicant has also made a full disclosure of all relevant facts related   to the authorisation of the abduction, assault and killing of the Deceased.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="91">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="92">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>I concur that Japie Maponya is   a victim as envisaged in the Act and the names and particulars of his next-of-kin   is to be forwarded to the Reparations and Rehabilitation Committee for its consideration.</text>
		</line>
		<line number="93">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text></text>
		</line>
		<line number="94">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>MR W MALAN</text>
		</line>
		<line number="95">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>??</text>
		</line>
		<line number="96">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>/...</text>
		</line>
		<line number="97">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>2</text>
		</line>
		<line number="98">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>___</text>
		</line>
		<line number="99">
			<speaker></speaker>
			<text>/...</text>
		</line>
	</lines>
</hearing>