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CHAIRPERSON: Mrs Nomandla, good morning.

N A NOMANDLA: Morning sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Can you please introduce the person who is with you?

N A NOMANDLA: This is my sister-in-law.

CHAIRPERSON: We welcome her too. Mrs Nomandla you have come to talk about yourself and what happened to you. Mrs Seroke is going to help you in telling your story, but before I hand over to her can you please stand to take the oath.

N AGNES NOMANDLA: (Duly sworn in, states).

MS SEROKE: We welcome you and your sister-in-law. You are going to tell us briefly your story, your assault and the killing of your husband. Just tell us briefly.

N A NOMANDLA: In 1991 on the 19th of March about 12 midnight. We could not sleep with my husband. Whilst we were sitting there, me and my husband on that night, we heard the gate, the gate chain was making a noise and I told my husband that somebody is trying to open the gate. He said no it is not our gate. He said it is from the neighbours. Whilst I was listening to that I told him it is our gate. He said no it is not.

At quarter to one he went outside and I told him that he must check the gate, if it is locked. He came back, he

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found that the chain was unlocked, but he said he could see no one outside. When he tried to sleep he heard somebody breaking the window. I told him the window is breaking. He said, no it is not our window. We woke up, we heard somebody had a newborn baby in the next room. She was carrying the baby naked in her hands. She was standing in the front room. I went into the childrens room and took them out through the window. The other one was standing next to the dining room. I asked her why does she not go out. She said she is scared because Mr Gaai is standing next to the door.

When I opened the door he ran away, Gaai. He hid behind the grapes. At that time the house was on fire. I took her out. She was scared to run away and she stood next out next to the door. Her father went out as well via the kitchen door trying to chase these people in order to fight with them. I used the front door to go out and that is where I met Morris Masingyetza and I fought with him. Whilst I was fighting with Morris Masingyetza, Thomas Mvudle pushed me and hit me with a fist. That is where I lost my three teeth.

When I went to the house their father ran outside next to the house trying to find the girl who had a baby in her hands. I tried to do the same as well. I stood on the verandah. I was standing next to Thomas Kunene and Tony Tshabalala told Thomas that he said shoot and Thomas Munene did not shoot. He just dropped his handgun and Tony Tshabalala grabbed the gun and shot one shot and I retreated. He shot the second shot and that him on his left shoulder. It went through and it came through his left breast. When he fell down I went back into the house and I

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closed the door. They shot the door. As to who shot, I did not see. I went back into the house and he was still lying outside.

Whilst I was in the house I saw my brother going into his house. They had grabbed him as well. The people who were in the yard, there were six. They were seven, but I do not know the seventh one, but I know the six in full. It was Tony Tshabalala, Gahiema Seko, Morris Masinyetza, Thomas Mvudle, Thomas Munene and Kitis Scosco.

Having left just a few minutes Thomas Nkonza arrived. He came inside the house and I was standing with my daughter. He said what has burnt down here. I can refund in five minutes. I told him he must not commit himself because he does not know what happened. I asked him, do you know what happened. He did not answer me, he just left. Just ten minutes after he had left policemen arrived. The policmen took me and my daughter to the police station and they took a statement. We came back and we had a hash with us and it took my husband away.

MS SEROKE: Agnes, you have told us about six to seven people and you have mentioned there names as well. When they came inside your house to attack and burn down, what was the reason.

N A NOMANDLA: I never asked them.

MS SEROKE: Who are they? Are they a certain gang?

N A NOMANDLA: They are the Mazimzim Gang.

MS SEROKE: At home, to which group did you belong to?

N A NOMANDLA: I was a member of the Womens League and my daughter was a Comrade in the Youth League.

MS SEROKE: In other words, Mazimzim were attacking the ANC members or any people who were involved in the political

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struggle.

N A NOMANDLA: Initially the Mazimzim were Comrades. They were called the Mazimzim because in August 1990 on the sixth there was a South African Police aeroplane that was dropping papers from the air. They said that if anyone could catch people who were burning down houses, they will be rewarded with R5 000.00. It was only Friday during the week and on the Tuesday that is when this group started, the Mazimzim.

MS SEROKE: When they started were they looking for people who were burning the houses or were they just looking for a reward.

N A NOMANDLA: According to the police if they find the people who burn down the houses, they will get the reward, but instead they decided to be Mazimzim, not to be Comrades, just to get this reward of R5 000.00.

MS SEROKE: Are these people still around?

N A NOMANDLA: They are still around, but they do not belong to groups anymore, but they are still around.

MS SEROKE: How are you communicating with them when you are aware that they did kill your husband?

N A NOMANDLA: In brief, I told myself that I am a Christian and anybody who does anything of this nature to me, God will see to that.

MS SEROKE: Did you not perhaps institute a case against these people?

N A NOMANDLA: In 1991 police never came. They only started coming to my house in 1992 in February. They came to take a statement. And the statement, after having taken the statment, it took time before the case appeared in court. It was in 1992 in Klerksdorp when we appeared in court. From Klerksdorp in 1995 in July on the 15th we appeared in

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Potchefstroom court and that was the last time we appeared in court.

On the 15th of December 1995 they sent me some papers to say that my matter is resuming again. I wanted to know who appealed because I did not. They said the Government realised that procedures were not observed and therefore the case must be resumed. They told me that the matter is dismissed and they will send papers to the Attorney-General. Until today, when I decided to hand the matter over to the Truth Commission, Johannesburg.

MS SEROKE: Agnes, what did you do to try and renovate your house after it was burnt?

N A NOMANDLA: I did not renovate it, but I just installed windows. I did not renovate it because my children and neighbours tried to extinguish the fire. All I did, I just painted the house, but I could not manage to paint the other room. It is leaking when there are rainfalls.

MS SEROKE: Are you working?

N A NOMANDLA: No, I am not.

MS SEROKE: How do you survive?

N A NOMANDLA: I am staying next to my brother who he is supportive and my friend as well.

MS SEROKE: How many children do you have?

N A NOMANDLA: Eight children.

MS SEROKE: What are they doing? Are they still studying or are they working?

N A NOMANDLA: Three are studying and the other ones are grandchildren. The eldest cannot get employment.

MS SEROKE: This Nkonza that you have mentioned, is he a policeman or is he a member of the Mazimzim gang?

N A NOMANDLA: He is a policeman, but he was a member of the KRUGERSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG

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Mazimzim. The Mazimzims' were getting their arms from them. MS SEROKE: You say when this happened Nkonza's van was just three houses away from you. Did he not try to stop this?

N A NOMANDLA: No, he never did.

MS SEROKE: And even the Hippos' were standing at the street behind our street. Nkonza came into the house and he left for the police station. That is when the Hippos' passed by and they were laughing.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Ms Seroke. Dr Ally.

DR ALLY: Mrs Nomandla, you said that you were a member of the ANC Womens League, your daughter was part of the Youth Congress. What about your husband, was he also a member of the ANC?

N A NOMANDLA: No, he was not a member. He was not a member of any organisation.

DR ALLY: What was his work when he died, at the time of his death?

N A NOMANDLA: He was working at the Telephone Department.

DR ALLY: Now, I just want to ask you a few more questions about Mazimzims'. You say initially they were Comrades.

N A NOMANDLA: Yes, that is true.

DR ALLY: Does that mean they were part of the ANC structures?

N A NOMANDLA: Yes, that is true.

DR ALLY: And then subsequently, how long were they in existence before this inicident that you are talking about?

N A NOMANDLA: They did not leave the ANC openly. They were doing the things as if they were doing these things for the ANC, but at the same time they were working for the police.

DR ALLY: How did you come to find that out? Was that

common knowledge in the community?

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N A NOMANDLA: For me to understand that they are members of the Mazimzim. They sent one man to my house to call me. It was in the evening. Then I said to them, I will not go there, they must come here to me because there are children. Then that man said, why do I not go there? Then I told him that there are the children if they want me, not me going to them. What do they want to do with me? That is when I realised that they are working with the police for that

R5 000.00 reward which they wanted.

DR ALLY: Now that leaflet that you mentioned that was dropped out of a helicopter or police plane, do you have copies of that?

N A NOMANDLA: Yes, it was there. I put two of them because of the burning of the house. Many things were burnt inside the house.

DR ALLY: Who was your lawyer at the time?

N A NOMANDLA: He is Hunief, he is a member of the ANC.

DR ALLY: (Inaudible) Hunief Valley.

N A NOMANDLA: Yes, that is true.

CHAIRPERSON: You do not want to ask anymore questions? Mrs Nomandla, thank you very much for coming here today. This story is, we are going to hear much more about this today and hopefully we can come to some sort of understanding about what happened in the community at the time.

You lost your husband, a very important part of your life at the time. We are very sorry to hear about that. We hope that some of the questions that you are raising here today will be answered as we go along. We thank you again for coming. Is there anything else you want to say?

N A NOMANDLA: Yes, there is something I want to say because now I have a nine year old child. His father left him

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whilst he was not at a school and he is doing standard two. The whole of his life, who is going to take care of him, because now I have got a problem and that is the reason. If I die who is going to take care of him and pay his school expenses because his father could not do that?

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you. As you know part of the work of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission is, there is a committee called the Reparation and Rehabilitation Committee. They are working on two policies. One is what we call an urgent interim relief policy and the other one is a reparations policy.

Both these policies will be given to Government and Government will actually debate and discuss it before they agree to the implementation. We, as part of our work, as part of the Human Rights Violations Committee need to make further investigation on what you have told us before we can decide whether you are a victim. Once that is done your name will be forwarded to the Reparations Committee, but let me say and, I think it is a very important question that you have raised, that we will be waiting on Government finally to decide on this reparation policy. So I hope that for you and for many other people who are raising this question and this question has been raised many a time, that Government will hear what the Truth Commission has to say on this policy and some implementation will take place. But it will not take place immediately. Thank you.

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