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Content
A listing of transcripts of the dialogue and narrative of this section.
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Structure
The list provides the transcript, info about the text, and links to references contained in the text.
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Special Report
Transcripts for Section 2 of Episode 85
| Time | Summary | | | 32:36 | Max, can I say something here? // Yes please. // You see I think this is part of my problem with the TRC and this is that it becomes a slippery slope. It’s now being used to demand black restitution. Restitution to blacks; redistribution of wealth. Bishop Tutu says that if I steal your pen and I ask for forgiveness, it’s no good if I don’t return your pen. Now, what previous Truth Commissions have established is that the conflict must be over before you actually tackle a Truth Commission, like in Chile, before you introduce a Truth Commission. Now, my feeling is that all the revelations of atrocities are being used to try and coerce whites and imbue them with a guilty conscience so that they pay some kind of reparation tax. Redistribution must take place, black empowerment must take place, but I think the Truth Commission is being used for devious purposes here. | Full Transcript | | 33:29 | Mr. Mzizi your view on reconciliation. // Yes, if I may chip in there. Max, who are we reconciling? We have failed utterly to reconcile the people if we are saying that. If probably … // Maybe that is the question. Who should we be reconciling? Are we talking about black people and white people rushing into the streets and hugging each other? // It’s an ambiguous term because if you look at the violence of the past the freedom fighters who were actually fighting apartheid. Now, there was black on black violence. Now where was the apartheid in black on black violence? We have suffered in the hands of the so-called liberators. // Are you saying that there can be reconciliation without the truth? // Without the truth there would be no reconciliation. Now what happened, the Act goes as far back as saying that even the human rights violation that took place outside the country. When are we going to start hearing about the Quatro camps and many other camps outside the country? // Well ...more | Full Transcript | | 35:23 | Alright Donald Woods it so happens that you have the final word, because we’ve run out of time. // Well, I agree with Maki in the sense that we’ve had more truth than reconciliation, but I think the truth was a necessary prerequisite. The reconciliation is still ahead of us, there’s a lot of work to do and I think both sides not just the ANC, everyone, we’ve all got to work at this and we’ve got to in the process - I think too many whites still underestimate the level of black anger and resentment – and the mistake was made that now it’s all over, everything is fine. It’s a nonsense. We’re only starting now and hopefully we’ll get there, but I think this was a necessary part of the process. | Full Transcript | | 36:04 | You go along with that? // Yes, I agree with that fully. | Full Transcript | | 36:08 | Well, maybe we’ve neglected to get to certain parts of the process in this debate. We’re certainly going to tackle it again. Also, if I were the Truth Commission, I’d be slightly worried not that many positive things were said about the Truth Commission process. But let’s get down with the rest of the programme. First thank you very much to Donald Woods, Maki Mandela and in Cape Town Herman Giliomee and Abraham Mzizi, thank you very much. | Full Transcript |
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